PICS: Ceramic Pro 9H - a new product from Europe not yet in the UK

[stuartzg]

Hi everyone,

 

I'm new to the forum and looking to constructively raise my post count so that I can offer my BMW plus cash to swap for a nice 370z - I thought there's no better way than to explain the process my own car has gone through over here and explain how great these products are. As a bit of background, I'm an expat living in Croatia, so keep my car over here when required and do a nice long drive once a year through Europe. 2 years ago I had the car detailed but I was never completely satisfied with the protection on the paint. When I started to research what was available over here I was introduced to a small company who started offering Ceramic Pro 12 months ago. From what I can see these materials haven't made it to the UK yet, but it originates from a German company who were involved in industry and have made their products suitable for cars (you can apply them to planes, boats, etc).

 

One of the benefits of living outside the UK is the cost of labour being significantly less here, as the whole process of detailing, paint correction, chemical cleaning of the interior, plus applying various coats of Ceramic Pro to the paintwork, wheels, glass and interior, is over 5 days of work for 2 people. Each time you apply a coat, you must let it harden. You also need special heat lamps and masks as the chemicals are toxic. So it's not really a DIY process like waxing is, but the results are amazing - with a 3 year warranty, the product is expected to stay on the car for the life of the car. It protects the paintwork, wheels, interior and glass (interior lasts around 6 months and needs a small reapply), it will protect up to 850c, offer excellent resistance to keying and scratches and protects from UV (great for Red paint). I will also never need to polish the car again, and when washing, all insects and dirt just falls off. There will also be no more swirls created by washing (or bad washers at BMW), and the car can even go through a car wash without any possibilities of scratches (not that I ever would!).

 

When I got the car back, it looked better than when it came from the factory.

 

Work completed:

3-stage detail and polish, 2 days work - removed 99% of paint defects, swirl marks and scratches

 

2 coats of Ceramic PRO 9H

2 coats of Ceramic PRO Sport

2 coats of Ceramic PRO Rain on the glass

 

Wheels:

Ceramic PRO Strong + Ceramic PRO Light

 

Interior:

Interior chemically cleaned

Seats removed

Leather fed twice, cleaned, resprayed back to factory colour (drivers seat was repaired badly when I bought the car at 2 years old)

Protected with Ceramic Pro for Leather

 

Total cost: £750

 

One thing I noticed when driving to Budapest last weekend was that I didnt even need to use the wipers during heavy rain, the rains instantly dissipates - quite a surreal experience for me and my passengers!

 

The finished result can be seen in the attachments.

 

If anyone wants any more info, I would be happy to go in to more detail. I'm hoping you'll ask questions, so that I can get my post count up!

Edited April 25, 2015 by stuartzg

[luka761]

Hi Stuart, I have a house in Croatia and sometimes drive the my 370z down there for the summer. Just out of interest where did you have this work done and how much would it be without the interior detailing?

[coldel]

A neighbour of mine had this done on his C63 merc here in the UK, ceramic coating done by a specialised dealership (Williams?), finish was lovely. Cost was around £1500 I think he said.

[Ricey]

I'm fairly sure Tim (Envy Valeting) offers Opticoat for far less than a main stealer.

 

Pretty sure that's ceramic

[coldel]

Yes have heard of the ceramic coating for a few years in the UK now, seems like a good solution although I would miss the fun in seeing the car get that lovely new coat of wax every couple of months

[luka761]

Is there no benefit to waxing the car when it has this finish?

[Ricey]

Is there no benefit to waxing the car when it has this finish?

Pretty sure it protects the paint but won't give the beading of wax.

[ed divine]

You actually go backwards when putting a wax on a coating of this type, the coatings sheet water very well and the wax doesn't adhere to the coating properly so only lasts a few weeks at best.

[ilogikal1]

^^^ That.

 

You can wax over a coating, but you're just wasting product really. A number of coatings these days have been developed to offer very good beading whilst maintaining the sheeting abilities too, so there's not really much to gain from topping a coating (with the exception of the sealants for the first week or two to avoid water spotting whilst the coating cures fully). And as Ed says, not much bonds to a coating either, so any additional layers are short lived.

[luka761]

Excuse my total ignorance, while I think I understand what you're talking about with beading and sheeting I'm primarily interested in how shiny my car looks. Can you explain how sheeting and beading relate to aforementioned desirable shininess? I also presume this coating protects the paint from minor damage more effectively than wax?

 

Just trying to weigh up how worth doing this is.

[coldel]

The polish will do the legwork in terms of making your car shiny, the wax coating protects that polish from the elements. Beading is when the water lands on the car and the wax effectively shrugs it off to form a bead shape, if you drive the car usually this then just runs off.

[ilogikal1]

Beading and sheeting relates to how water behaves on the surface, so it'll have no relation to how shiny/glossy it is.

 

The gloss will almost exclusively come from polishing before the coating, although many coatings (usually glass coatings though) can add a bit of extra gloss too.

 

Like waxes, there are billionty different products that offer a billionty different results. That also applies to the hardness of the coating and the protection it offers against swirling, even those that claim to be 9H (which is actually a meaningless claim at the best of times!) - the hardness of the paint underneath it will ultimately determine just how effective the swirl resistance will be and with Nissan's buttery soft paint you'll still get minor marring relatively easily no matter what you use.

 

The big plus point of coatings is the durability, whilst a wax might last a month or two between applications, coatings tend to last a year or two and aren't as easy to remove as waxes. They do also offer better self cleaning capabilities (as a rule) too, so the car will appear cleaner for longer.

[luka761]

I see, so if having this coating applied its critical that the car is polished and prepared to a really high standard since that is the shininess that you will be stuck with once the coat is applied?

 

I'm currently trying to see if its better to waste my money on Dodo supernatural or Autoglym high definition wax, as a novice detailer the amount of products is simply overwhelming.

[ilogikal1]

Essentially, yes - I don't know of any (reputable) detailer who would offer a coating without at least advising correction beforehand.

 

 

If you're after gloss, I would recommend spending your time and money on the preparation stages and stick to a decent, cost effective sealant like FK1000P for now - sealants will tend to offer more gloss than waxes by the way, but FK is so cheap and so easy to use that it's ideal for a novice IMO.

[luka761]

Doh! I've just bought some Dodo Juice Supernatural Wax! Didn't even know about this FK1000P stuff, hopefully it does roughly the same stuff. Many thanks by the way for all this information, its much appreciated.

Edited May 22, 2015 by luka761

[ilogikal1]

Worry not, Supernatural is a very good wax. It'll serve you well and still offers a fair amount of gloss, and as said before most of the gloss comes from the prep anyway

[coldel]

I use Supernatural Wax, £15 for a panel pot is good for a couple of coats of the car. Wasso spent something like 7 hours prepping and polishing my Zed a few years back, finished it up with Supernatural...results speak for themselves I think...

 

 

[luka761]

That looks lovely! May I ask what those wheels are?

[coldel]

Yes was an amazing bit of work by Ian, wheels Volks Racing GTV I got off another member for £1k, an absolute bargain they looked fantastic with the dish.

[sipar69]

I had Williams Ceramic Coating on my last Z. Still used to wax it though - I enjoyed the process and being outside, and it looked nice and shiny afterwards

 

 

Edited May 25, 2015 by sipar69

[coldel]

Ah yes thats what the Merc had that I tided up for a neighbour. The Williams Ceramic Coating.

[sipar69]

Coatings like the Williams are probably a good idea if you haven't got time or can't be bothered with waxing etc but if you get a kick out of keeping the car shiny I'm not sure they're worth the expense.

 

I used to get a good result on my last Z with the coating but I could never tell how much that was down to a decent wax and how much part the coating played.

 

I use Jetseal 109 on my current Z - lasts for months and costs a lot less than the Williams type stuff (£30 compared to £300+) (plus you can remove and re-coat a few times a year, and add a layer of wax every now and then to boost the shine).

 

Additionally, the Wiliams definitely didn't prevent those occasional little hairline scratches and little surface scuffs that every car seems to pick up from washing etc. The easy way to remove them is a quick polish with a cloth and something like Autoglym Super Resin polish, but presumably you remove a patch of the coating at the same time.

 

[ilogikal1]

costs a lot less than the Williams type stuff (£30 compared to £300+)

 

A coating will only cost £300 if you pay a dealer to throw it at a car (I won't even pretend that they actually apply it, even for that amount!), otherwise you're looking at about £50-80 retail for the actual product. Even most of the professional detailers will offer the non-retail coatings for around half that amount and they even apply it properly for that amount.

 

Additionally, the Wiliams definitely didn't prevent those occasional little hairline scratches and little surface scuffs that every car seems to pick up from washing etc.

 

Nothing will. A good coating, properly applied will offer resistance than a sealant like Jetseal though so you'll see less marring with a (good) coating than you would with a sealant, but you're right it won't eliminate them altogether. That is an issue caused by rubbing a harder, abrasive substance (such as grit) against the surface. This can be reduced with a good wash technique but even then you're only going to minimise the marring, you'll never eliminate swirling.

 

The easy way to remove them is a quick polish with a cloth and something like Autoglym Super Resin polish, but presumably you remove a patch of the coating at the same time.

 

Coatings will be removed by abrasives, yes, however SRP isn't abrasive. It won't actually remove that wash marring either, it's just full of fillers so will merely hide them temporarily until those fillers are washed away again, so you can use SRP over a coating without damaging it... of course it won't bond to the coating at all, so those fillers won't hide much for long anyway.

Also, just to be pedantic, you don't want to be polishing with a cloth either.

[sipar69]

Have you got too much time on your hands Captain Pedantry?

 

Seriously though, all fair points but my main point is that I actually enjoy the process of washing, prepping and waxing, so those coatings aren't really my thing.

[ilogikal1]

Yes, I very much do presently.

 

I know what you mean though, I do enjoy the whole process myself, although there are certain attributes of coatings that do appeal too.