Nissan Leaf....I love it!!

[gangzoom]

I would like to get a leaf just to block in all the twunts who park in electric car only charging bays when it is busy

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Don't worry 'Charge rage' is already here

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/10592660/Charge-Rage-electric-car-owners-get-angry-after-having-vehicles-unplugged.html

Edited April 13, 2015 by gangzoom

[spursmaddave]

I would like to get a leaf just to block in all the twunts who park in electric car only charging bays when it is busy

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Don't worry 'Charge rage' is already here

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/10592660/Charge-Rage-electric-car-owners-get-angry-after-having-vehicles-unplugged.html

 

Wow more Leafs than a wood in Autumn

 

Saw an 'electric' Scooby in a bay at IKEA the other week not quite on a par with parking in a disabled or child parking space when you shouldn't but still really ignorant in my book...

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[gangzoom]

Was at Nissan Leicester for a quick free top up charge (with coffee and newspaper ), whilst on the way to a meeting. Really surprised at the number of Leafs parked in the work area (5 including mine). At this rate, charge rage may become more of a problem for owners than range anxiety

 

Edited April 13, 2015 by gangzoom

[Ebized]

Looking at that picture tempts me to make a submission here: http://www.350z-uk.c...96892-room-101/

[gangzoom]

How about this, Leaf Nismo RC, apparently same drive train as Leaf

 

 

[Ekona]

Looks like a Peugeot.

[gangzoom]

It's not a great looker (or that fast), but I find my self turning round to check on it when walking away more than any of my previous cars

 

The more I drive the thing, the more I'm convinced (and my wife) that pure EVs (battery or hydrogen) is the way forwards.

 

I tend to do mainly stop/start urban driving, and in that situation the Leaf is 're-capturing' 1/3 of the energy used to move it through braking...and the re-fuel costs are staggeringly cheap, to a point it's almost stupid. This is my predicted electricity costs over the last 230 miles. But actually you can cut that down by 2/3, because of 'free for now' public charging I've only had to use 16kWh of my own electricity....230 miles in the 335i, at 25mpg would be close to £50....Yes I know every says 'I don't care about mpg/fuel cost' but having an extra £49 in my pocket for every 2 weeks of commuting purely on re-fuel costs alone is more than helpful to the Tesla fund....Fuel savings alone in 24 months will be enough to pay for the fancy air-suspension option

 

 

So...the more of this I use...

 

 

...The more of these options I get to have in 24 months time

 

Edited April 14, 2015 by gangzoom

[docwra]

The more I drive the thing, the more I'm convinced (and my wife) that pure EVs (battery or hydrogen) is the way forwards.

 

I tend to do mainly stop/start urban driving,

 

Boom, and theres the crippler. If you live in or close to a city, then youve got buses, trains, reliable taxis, you can probably even cycle to where you want to be.

If you dont, then anything running on a battery is not going to get you to work and back, knock down the shops, drop the kids off at various parties/clubs and get you home again, and those are just the expected journeys - what if you have to visit a relative in hospital, or go pick the mother in law up from the police station?

 

It also looks like the charge points are mainly in cities as well, theres one about 5 miles from me, then another about 8 and the rest are 12+ miles away, theres only 3 high speed points within the cars range from my house

[Grundy]

The more I drive the thing, the more I'm convinced (and my wife) that pure EVs (battery or hydrogen) is the way forwards.

 

I tend to do mainly stop/start urban driving,

 

Boom, and theres the crippler. If you live in or close to a city, then youve got buses, trains, reliable taxis, you can probably even cycle to where you want to be.

If you dont, then anything running on a battery is not going to get you to work and back, knock down the shops, drop the kids off at various parties/clubs and get you home again, and those are just the expected journeys - what if you have to visit a relative in hospital, or go pick the mother in law up from the police station?

 

It also looks like the charge points are mainly in cities as well, theres one about 5 miles from me, then another about 8 and the rest are 12+ miles away, theres only 3 high speed points within the cars range from my house

Just to add, what if you're on the M25 and they shut it due to a accident, or major traffic delays etc :S

 

Deffo not for me.

Edited April 14, 2015 by grundy225

[chips]

I'm sure I saw a Tesla in Folkestone West car park the other week, have been looking out for it again daily. Wondered about the charging situation but then by seeing it's there means something is in place.

Great review from someone with such car experience who has put £ down to own proper enthusiast drivers cars in the past with the Z and Beemer.

I saw a Tesla S on one of the Balerics about 1.5 years ago and went 'What's that???, I want one'

Their lotus one doesn't really count and the current ones were only in Europe and USA but the more i found out about it the more I wanted in.

I was prepared to put my £ where my mouth is and bought shares in the company, currently about +37%- which doesn't mean a whole lot knowing the fickleness of the markets and also being a new company, just my way of getting on board.

And what i noticed the other month is that the country that leads the way in all things automotive- Japan, is surprisingly full of Prius', which perhaps is also a glimpse of the future.

[gangzoom]

It seems most people are concerned about:

 

1: Range

2: Charging

 

But strangely enough those are two things I worry least about in the Leaf. Ok if I was still doing a 100 miles commute daily that would be a issue, but if that was the case, i would have just bought a Tesla S now (well most likely 'financed' rather than out-right purchase), and range becomes a non-issue (unless your doing more than 200 miles a day). The comment about cycling/walking/buses can get every where if you live in a city is just a odd thing to say, how many people on this forum live less than 20 miles away from work and still use their car all the time?? How many people on the forum actually even know where their nearest bus stop is, let alone get on one in the last 1 year?? I do cycle quite a bit, probably more than most people on this forum (most threads about cycling on this forum is usually negative anyways). But actually with the Leaf, it's cheaper for me to drive, because I consume more 'food' for every mile cycle than it costs me to 're-fuel' the Leaf.

 

Charging. This is only a issue because I'm currently trying too see if I can actually run this thing for totally ZERO cost to me interms of electricity. So actively seeking out free public charge points. Simplest thing to do is actually just to plug into my newly installed home charger (which takes 30 seconds) twice a week overnight, but so far in 300 miles of driving over 2 weeks I've not even used the home charger once

 

In traffic the Leaf uses 0.2-0.5 kWh of battery for the radio/heater, so even with less than half charge, your be fine for about 20hrs, long after everyone else's ICE car have run out of petrol.....Unlike an ICE, when the electric motor is stopped, it draws no power, and is most efficient going slowly...Infact miles/kWh goes UP when stuck in traffic jams, as does the range!!

 

I actually think if more people tried out these things for themselves, worked out the costs, more people would actually see why most EV owners have no interest in driving anything that has a ICE in it.

 

The Tesla is really tempting though, especially the new 70D version at £55K, if I haven't committed to the Leaf (and like it so much), I would find it very hard not to order one....Even my wife is happy for me to order the Tesla to replace the Leaf in 18 months time....and she is normally very sensible with money, so for her to agree to wasting £55K on a car, you know it's got be something special

 

Infinite are also working on an EV, but they aren't due to announce anything for a while yet

Edited April 14, 2015 by gangzoom

[Ekona]

So who pays for the free charging points?

[docwra]

Its great to see you are so effusive about your Leaf, but the reason youre happy is because it suits your situation, the point I was making was that your situation is not the same as pretty much anyone I know, for instance, this is probably why you arent worried about the same things as everyone else.

 

Id love to get the bus to work, but its a 4 hour each way trip and about £22 a day, not to mention I wouldnt be able to go out and get lunch, visit clients etc. once I was at the office. I commute about 35 miles each way so would be terrified of running out of juice, particularly as there arent any charging points near me, not everyone has £15K to chuck on a new car either. Never mind £55K for a Tesla, running cost reduction or not

 

Put it another way, if we ran a poll on here as to who would swap their 370Z for 100hp shopping car I think we call know the outcome. If it was financially viable then Id certainly look at chopping our 207 diesel second car in for one, but then what car are we going to use for 50+ mile journeys when fuel costs are more important?

 

Its very similar to the early mobile phones for me - amazing tech, undoubtedly the future but not quite at the point that your average man in the street can adopt due to range, cost and charging.

Edited April 14, 2015 by docwra

[ioneabee]

So who pays for the free charging points?

weeee dooooo

[chips]

It's on its way.

In the country where a 6.2l v8 is mans standard car and the distance between the 2 closest together cities is further than the distance of the North-South England.

 

Tesla's making it happen, who knows why they're doing the hard way?

http://www.drive.com.au/motor-news/tesla-confirms-first-regional-supercharger-20150414-1mk8lv.html

[RobPhoboS]

Mods - we've got a TROLL !!!!

 

[spursmaddave]

The more I drive the thing, the more I'm convinced (and my wife) that pure EVs (battery or hydrogen) is the way forwards.

 

I tend to do mainly stop/start urban driving,

 

Boom, and theres the crippler. If you live in or close to a city, then youve got buses, trains, reliable taxis, you can probably even cycle to where you want to be.

If you dont, then anything running on a battery is not going to get you to work and back, knock down the shops, drop the kids off at various parties/clubs and get you home again, and those are just the expected journeys - what if you have to visit a relative in hospital, or go pick the mother in law up from the police station?

 

It also looks like the charge points are mainly in cities as well, theres one about 5 miles from me, then another about 8 and the rest are 12+ miles away, theres only 3 high speed points within the cars range from my house

Just to add, what if you're on the M25 and they shut it due to a accident, or major traffic delays etc :S

 

Deffo not for me.

 

Perfect for you surely.... comes direct from the factory without an engine

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[gangzoom]

Its great to see you are so effusive about your Leaf, but the reason youre happy is because it suits your situation, the point I was making was that your situation is not the same as pretty much anyone I know, for instance, this is probably why you arent worried about the same things as everyone else.

 

Id love to get the bus to work, but its a 4 hour each way trip and about £22 a day, not to mention I wouldnt be able to go out and get lunch, visit clients etc. once I was at the office. I commute about 35 miles each way so would be terrified of running out of juice, particularly as there arent any charging points near me, not everyone has £15K to chuck on a new car either. Never mind £55K for a Tesla, running cost reduction or not

 

Put it another way, if we ran a poll on here as to who would swap their 370Z for 100hp shopping car I think we call know the outcome. If it was financially viable then Id certainly look at chopping our 207 diesel second car in for one, but then what car are we going to use for 50+ mile journeys when fuel costs are more important?

 

Its very similar to the early mobile phones for me - amazing tech, undoubtedly the future but not quite at the point that your average man in the street can adopt due to range, cost and charging.

 

I 100% take all your points, like I said it wasn't that long ago (2 months to be exact) I was spending 3 hrs a day doing a 100 mile round trip commute. I certainly don't mind paying an early adopter 'tax' to get something like a Tesla. But the Leaf, with all the deals going is no more expensive to own than any number of 'normal' family hatchbacks, and for lots of people it will work well as a commuter car, but clearly for a lot it wouldn't.

 

I certainly didn't think 6 months ago, I'll be loving driving a Leaf to work and back, infact even 1 months ago I hadn't even given the Leaf a second glance. But there are some really good deals going support by ALOT of tax payers money (as other's have pointed out - Should a £60K Tesla be supported by a £5K government grant?? I personally don't think so, but that's a different debate).

 

With 3 years old Leafs costing only £9K including the cost of the battery, thats the same price as a 3 year old Ford Fiesta. I would argue, actually Nissan, through the Leaf have made EVs viable as a daily car for lots of people....These things aren't magical machines of the future (like hydrogen fuel cell cars), they are here and now, for every one to buy/use. I really don't think Nissan gets enough credit for the money they have pumped into developing and mass producing the Leaf (made in Swindon). For all my talk about Tesla, the first EV car I've bought with my own cash is a Leaf

 

The Audi A3 e-tron, VW e-Golf, Kia Soul EV are just some 'normal' looking EVs which have just come out, but they are pretty expensive bits of kit compared to the Leaf but none really better the Leaf, and when Nissan announces the next gen Leaf in 2016, they will be easily a generation ahead of the competition.

Edited April 14, 2015 by gangzoom

[spursmaddave]

I think as a commuter vehicle it would be hard to beat as long as you consider range, charging etc and the money you save can fund a nice big engine car for weekends and fun driving

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Ekona]

So who pays for the free charging points?

weeee dooooo

That's what I thought.

 

So what happens when they stop being free and you get charged £10 to fill up, or £20? The £5k subsidy likely ends this year, which then makes these things not such the bargain at that point. £55k for a Tesla seems good in theory, but then that would buy you a year-old M3 and a shed load of petrol to run it. I know which would be more involving, too.

 

I mean, I'll be honest and say part of my ranting is jealousy, as I wish I could have an EV for the 10min commute and save a packet, but my circumstances will never permit that. I'd never, ever want an EV as my fun car though, not whilst we still have petrol.

 

I am genuinely glad you're enjoying it though mate, it's refreshing to see someone so enthusiastic and able to back up their reasoning with sound logic

[DoogyRev]

Check this out . . .

 

http://www.smash.com/zombie-22-converted-68-mustang-quickest-car-world/

 

A very interesting read and watch . . . Perhaps Darren can bung some batteries in the 240z

[gangzoom]

 

 

So what happens when they stop being free and you get charged £10 to fill up, or £20? The £5k subsidy likely ends this year, which then makes these things not such the bargain at that point.

 

Day time domestic electricity is 15p kWh, or 6l kWh at night if you have a Economic 7 meter.

 

So if you put 24 kWh into a Leaf it's a maximum of £3.5, cheapest £1.45 per 80-90 miles. A Tesla S with a 85 kWh battery will cost maximum of £12 to £5. for 260-300 miles of range. Currently the charge points that so cost money either charge at 14 p / kWH or have a yearly / monthly fee. Plug-in Midlands cards only cost £10 for a year, to access all their charger points.

 

Most EV owners charge up at home during the night, if you have solar panels on the house than it also reduce costs....So to answer you question on charge...It's still very very cheap. The only way prices will go up is if electricity costs go up. But unlike petrol the government cannot TAX it like mad, without it impacting in ALL other appliances that needed electricity.

 

The £5k grant is likely to carry on till at least 2020. The 'free' home charger grant has been extended till than, but now costs £200 rather than been totally free. The government have recently introduced a 'traiff' system, where EV/hybrids are ranked. Currently ALL EV/hybrids gets £5K off, so even the Porsche Panamera/Merc S class hybrid get £5k despite been able to cover about only 10 miles on EV mode. Under the new tariff it's likely only pure battery EVs will qualify for the full £5k off.....Personally I think even battery EVs that have a list prices of greater than £50k should also be off the list, and that money used to give a bigger discount for cheaper EVs to drive up adoption rates. I know that would mean I would have to pay £60k for a Tesla rather than £55k, but if you can afford a £55k to start off with, you don't need a £5k grant from the government....

 

But as it stands my plan is to have a driveway consisting of ONLY EVs by 2020, so hopefully I'll be getting about £15k worth of EV grants + 2-3 home chargers (maybe one for the parents house once we have two chargers at home), assuming I get a Tesla to replace the Leaf, and the wife gets either a Infiniti or another Tesla to replace her Lexus (even though we have just bough it )

 

Finally on the point of 'engaging to drive', have you driven a Tesla? I haven't, so why dismiss something based on pre-formed misconceptions?? I honestly cannot see how 691 BHP would be not entertaining ...and don't forget this is only the start of EVs. All current cars are really 1.0 devices (some are probably 0.95 releases).

 

Cars like the M3 have evolved over decades, but if Tesla can deploy a 691bhp machine just two years after launching the Tesla S (it's not even had a 'facelift' yet), can you imagine how good the next generation of products will be....I know I cannot wait to see what they will announce next. I really have 0% interest in any ICE cars regardless of price/performance, as far as am concerned ICEs cars are like Nokia phones in 2007 when Apple first announced the iPhone. Loads of them around everywhere, they work fine, but you know they will all be in the bin sooner rather than later .....If I was a betting man I would go and buy some Tesla shares (should have also bought Apple shares back in 2007).

Edited April 15, 2015 by gangzoom

[Crb]

I've recently had this for a week

 

 

This is Nissans electric van option. I've got to say it's a great piece of kit especially when it's used for local deliveries. I was a bit sceptical at first about the performance but the range and the costs seemed to add up well so I thought I'd give it a try.

What a great vehicle tho.... The Instant torque on it was unbelievable and getting up to 70 was well under 10seconds. And for the week I had it, I only had to plug it in twice.

 

Honestly guys if you've never tried one go book a little test drive just for a bit of fun.

 

But unfortunately I didn't buy it for two main reasons.

 

1: It just wasn't big enough for me

 

2: Everytime a version with a bigger range is introduced it renders the previous version worthless.

 

Oh and the salesman said that it was quicker than a 370 lol.... He looked a bit sheepish when he saw my 350

 

 

[Ekona]

Stuff, edited for space, sorry dude!

At the moment we (as in the taxpayer) are paying for the purchase, install, running and maintenance of these points. When that subsidy stops, the cost will leap and companies will seek to make active profit with an easy number. Sure, your home costs don't change but then that's not the point I'm trying to make.

 

I read an article the other day (which, typically, I now cannot find) that said the subsidy was limited to X number of cars, and the massive take up increase on these in the last couple of years meant that the cap would be breached the end of this year. If I've got that wrong, my mistake. Certainly other articles I've now been and found back up your view more than mine. Sure, it won't affect the people paying £50K+ for a car, but then they're being bought in tiny numbers comparatively to the small cars like the Leaf, the Zoe and more importantly the i3, which is what will drive demand.

 

I've not driven an EV, you're right. However, give me the choice of a 600bhp diesel or a 200bhp petrol and I'm choosing the petrol every time. It's not about power, it's not about acceleration or speed, it's about how the whole package makes you feel when you drive it. I can see how 700bhp would be fun for a week, but I'd want something to hold my attention a bit longer than that. Plus, I like fiddling with cars, so to have something that I cannot modify at all drivetrain wise is a no-go for me personally.

 

 

There's a place for the battery stuff, but it's WITH an ICE, not instead of. Let it give me more power or positively affect the drivetrain (like a P1 or LaF) or let it allow me to pootle around in the city on electric bit then open the taps when in the country (like the 918). Even the i8 is a good step forward, but that needed an I6 not an I3 to be appealing to me.

[Ebized]

When it needs a replacement battery pack, it is not going to be a £50 jobbie from your local Halfords........