brillomaster Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 I'll admit, im having impure thoughts about other cars... specifically the BMW E46 M3. I've had my zed coming up to 3 years now, and while its still great, I am getting itchy feet to try something else - the requirements for that are it must be faster than a 53 plate 350z, and have a manual gearbox. Why is it that most fast big engined stuff only has automatic gearboxes? My ideal car would be a BMW 650ci with a manual gearbox, but that just doesn't exist. which brings me neatly onto the BMW M3 - 3.2 litres, 338bhp, 0-60 in 5.1 seconds, comes with a manual! But has anyone driven one to compare? the things that appeal to me are a 8,000rpm redline, obviously more power, and a more refined place to sit, but on the other hand, the torque figure is very similar to a zeds, so would I have to redline it everywhere for it to feel any faster? also how does it drive compared to a zed? the zed to me feels rather heavy, and a bit lazy in turn in and roll, is the M3 better in this respect? i'm also being swayed by having a BMW 330ci already as a track car, and before we took everything out of it it was a great touring car - quiet and comfortable and felt expensive (even though it wasn't) would an M3 be more of the same, only faster? Lastly... i'm tempted by a flappy paddle SMG gearbox - are these any good? I like the idea of blatting up and down the box with the paddles like an F1 driver! I figure I can sell my zed for around £6k, put another £5k in and buy a decent M3 with less than 60,000 on the clock... sound good? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarmac@TarmacSportz Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 I have Good cars as long as you pick a decent example, which from your budget it will be Bit twitchy this time of year on the roads but not really any different to the zed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Driven one on road and track. Road was a coupe manual, track was an SMG ragtop. The interior looks dated, but is made of good quality stuff. I'd say it's an equal for a 350Z, rather than just better. The engine is a peach, loves to rev and makes a great noise. Needs a good intake though! M3 felt much heavier than the Zed, although I found it much easier to slide perversely. No idea why. Brakes are sh*t and need upgrading. Seriously, you'll kill them far too easily as stock. SMG 'box takes some getting used to, but I do quite like it. However, big bills when they go wrong as my mate with the ragtop has found out... It just feels a bit big to be a sports car, but if you're happy with the BMW now then that's not a problem. I wouldn't say it felt significantly better on the turn in than a Zed, if at all. 645s are also available in the manual, but that's proper barging! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
370Ad Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 (edited) I agree with Ekona. Its different to a Z but also very comparable. I feel the Z is too heavy, so is the M3. The 50's brakes overheat far too quickly, so does the M3. Both are 10+ years old now so inside it a bit dated. The M3 is quicker in a straight line but not enough just to move because of that. It does have 4 seats though if that's a plus?! Edited December 16, 2014 by 370Ad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brillomaster Posted December 16, 2014 Author Share Posted December 16, 2014 (edited) thing is im definitely looking for refinement - as you know I've got a track car which is noisy, hot and uncomfortable, which means my roadcars are driven rather more sedately - for a roadcar, I want a nice comfy place to sit, an engine that makes a great noise, and is happiest at a brisk cruise along A roads with plenty of grunt to overtake. it also needs to be tolerable for my fiancé for weekends away! for this reason any real lightweight (lotus, caterham, s2000) is out, I need to be able to do the daily commute in it as well. 645ci with a manual gearbox is a good shout - less to go wrong as its less highly strung, and the way i'll be driving it, probably faster than an M3 as it'll have a lot more torque low down the rev range. and it looks better, and has a better interior... trouble is finding a manual 645ci that hasn't been to the moon and back already - its a lot easier to find a low mileage M3. but then again, I cant get over the prospect of owning a BMW M3 - after all, that's a car we all lusted after as a teenager, right? Edited December 16, 2014 by brillomaster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GIXXERUK Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Borrowed an m3, I wasn't impressed enough to buy one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 I own a 2004 e46 m3 coupe (smg) and a 2007 350z HR (manual). Aesthetics aside, I think the M3 is the all round better car. It's more practical (4 seats, boot), more comfortable (seats, road noise), faster in a straight line, faster round a track and it doesn't hit every speed bump going (neither of my cars are lowered). If you're in it for the joy ride, both my cars have uprated exhausts and the M sounds better (racier), though I do acknowledge that the M3's 'rasp' isn't to everybody's liking. If you're in it for track days, both are fairly heavy and need upgraded brakes to get the most out of them, but comparing like for like, the M handles better imho (lighter, stiffer, less roll) and it 'feels' faster - though that's probably 'just' the zorst noise and flappy-paddle 'box The HR looks prettier though, and only having two seats means you don't ever get lumped driving hordes of people around Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 I'd buy a 350Z again, but I wouldn't buy an E46 M3. It's just not exciting enough for me, it doesn't feel special even with that engine. It is a fantastic all-rounder though, so if you had kids then it's ideal. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarnie Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Great cars, I've had two and currently have an SMG vert for sale whenever I get around to doing a listing, or might just keep it for the summer depending on how quickly the Mrs get fed up of the full drive! Doesn't sound as good as a Zed but it is quicker and I love the SMG box and would only buy one with it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhackyWill Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Drove the ones at the School at Brands. Was impressed. a lot different to a Zed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 ...I'd buy a 350Z again, but I wouldn't buy an E46 M3... I normally agree with everything you say, but not this... I'm the total opposite. I'm currently looking at getting rid of the Zed and will probably replace it with another M3. (Won't stop me hanging out on here though - if the Jag fogies can stay, so can the M owners! ) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brillomaster Posted December 16, 2014 Author Share Posted December 16, 2014 hmm maybe I should stick with swoopy coupes while I still can - I don't need a practical car yet. the ability to occasionally take a few people on a short journey would be nice, but 95% of the time any back seats would be empty. I think i'm being swayed off the idea a bit now... since it would cost quite a bit to upgrade to an M3, but doesn't sound like it would give that many benefits that I would use - while rear seats and an 8000rpm redline and an extra 60bhp sound good on paper, an extra £5k is a lot for some features that will be unused for 95% of the time. whereas if I got a torquey V8 6 series, i'd use the torque every day on the motorway, and it would be an arguably nicer place to be! and they're cheaper! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N4eay Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 I owned a 05 M3 manual for a while. In summary, nice car, awesome engine, didn’t like the manual box throws were too long! and clutch was very heavy. Obviously inspection 2 servicing is £££, at the time I had mine it was around the £900 mark. The older ones have the potential rear subframe issue, so one to watch out for and check. Also check for running in service and that the valve shims have been checked / replaced at the required intervals. A lot of car for the money but costs quite a bit more that a Z to run and maintain properly. Also worth getting one with the Harmon Kardon system as standard stereo is naff! Have a HR Z now, wouldn't go back but glad I had one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andywatson Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 ...I'd buy a 350Z again, but I wouldn't buy an E46 M3... I normally agree with everything you say, but not this... I'm the total opposite. I'm currently looking at getting rid of the Zed and will probably replace it with another M3. (Won't stop me hanging out on here though - if the Jag fogies can stay, so can the M owners! ) +1 Ex -SMG owner, 1 of the only cars I would buy again, loved it I'm still a Cutter too Commander í ½í± Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roscoe Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Just reading this post, strange how the majority say the m3 is a quicker car in a straight line.. I recently had a go in a mates one (e46 smg) the cars where almost identical in straight line performance mine being a HR zed. I do agree with other points though the m3 is definitely a more comfortable car to drive and has superior build quality! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Just reading this post, strange how the majority say the m3 is a quicker car in a straight line.. I recently had a go in a mates one (e46 smg) the cars where almost identical in straight line performance mine being a HR zed. I do agree with other points though the m3 is definitely a more comfortable car to drive and has superior build quality! What do you mean, it's strange? It's true! lol I've done a 30-130 in my HR Zed next to my brother's E46 M3 (SMG Coupe) - the M3 won by about 5 car lengths. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roscoe Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Just reading this post, strange how the majority say the m3 is a quicker car in a straight line.. I recently had a go in a mates one (e46 smg) the cars where almost identical in straight line performance mine being a HR zed. I do agree with other points though the m3 is definitely a more comfortable car to drive and has superior build quality! What do you mean, it's strange? It's true! lol I've done a 30-130 in my HR Zed next to my brother's E46 M3 (SMG Coupe) - the M3 won by about 5 car lengths. Ha see that's a significant difference if you ask me! When we did this it was more like half a cars length. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarnie Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Different drivers etc etc etc. The M3 is definitely quicker. But, it's a quick 3 series. It doesn't feel that it's been designed from the ground up as a dedicated performance car, like the zed. It's a 3 series with flared arches and a bonnet bulge. That doesn't mean it's not a great car, because it is, especially for the money you can pick them up for! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamez Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 (edited) I've had a remapped 03 350z and a 06 350z revup with quite a few mods, not exactly a fair comparison but I've just bought 100% stock 05 plate m3 manual coupe. The m3 is easily faster 0-60 in 5 seconds vs 350z 0-60 in 6 seconds, but I miss the centre dials in my 350z. I loved having the digital speedo visable. I can't seem to find a good seating position in the m3 even though i have lumbar support, inflatable bolsters. Digital freeview etc I still miss my 350z The nav in the m3 is pants even with the latest maps it doesn't know where its going and looks dated. The MPG is down. The handling is twitchy, loses traction at the rear too easily, and Rolls more which doesn't inspire confidence. Its Softer over the Bumps though. I've found myself looking at my m3 keys and then picking up my brothers z4mc keys on the way out, as although it has the same engine it feels like a proper sports car rather than a fast saloon. Better handling, steering and much more exciting I felt I had to get an m3 once in my life but i cant see myself keeping it long tbh. PS 8000RPM is lovely! Edited December 16, 2014 by flamez Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybp Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 i looked at e46 m3's at the same time as the z as i was coming from an e46 328 coupe the only thing that made me buy the z was that there are loads of m3's around here all driven by angry looking Tw*ts with sunglasses and shaved heads a look which doesn't suit me and the z put a silly grin on my face the m3 is very good maybe too good but didn't have the grin factor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chirag1988 Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 If you want more power, supercharge your zed you'll get a lot more than 60bhp increase for your money! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhackyWill Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 BMW 330ci is a far more practical car than a M3, you can use it every day for poodling about and when you want to release the pony's it goes like stink..!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarnie Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 BMW 330ci is a far more practical car than a M3, you can use it every day for poodling about and when you want to release the pony's it goes like stink..!! How is a 330ci 'far more practical' than an M3? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamez Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 330ci is 230bhp, m3 is 340bhp also they have the same body so same practicality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarnie Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 they have the same body so same practicality. Exactly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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