Fodder Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 I bet more drivers don't speed daily than do. I don't think cyclists break the law more than drivers, it's just that they're more noticeable when they do because they're a rarer sight on the roads. Same reason people think all sports car drivers drive like hooligans. Voice of relative reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 Rare that, coming from me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevoD Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 (edited) ? Edited September 24, 2014 by StevoD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevoD Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 (edited) ? Edited September 24, 2014 by StevoD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevoD Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 (edited) ? Edited September 24, 2014 by StevoD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fodder Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 most car crimes are subjective to opinion of a witness most bike crimes are obvious acts of law breaking Ie i think the man in the car was driving carelessly vs that cyclist went threw a red light think that makes sense I disagree. I spend more time in a car, I stated how I use a bike to prove this. I'm not pro cyclist over motorist. I'm trying to bring balance to the debate which I know is futile here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 Very few car crimes are subjective. DWDCA/CD/DD are the only ones I can think of. All others are objective. i.e. speeding, jumping amber lights, not wearing a seat belt etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevoD Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 (edited) ? Edited September 24, 2014 by StevoD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldel Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 I bet more drivers don't speed daily than do. I don't think cyclists break the law more than drivers, it's just that they're more noticeable when they do because they're a rarer sight on the roads. Same reason people think all sports car drivers drive like hooligans. Voice of relative reason. You should live in London mate, upper richmond road in putney (somewhat bizarrely) is one of the routes dear Boris decided most cyclists should take in and out of London, without a cycle lane introduced. More cycles use that road than cars literally pelatons of them. There are about five sets of pedestrian lights along the road that NONE of the cyclists stop at, its as if mob mentality has ensued and because one fat overweight bank manager in lycra has jumped all the lights everyone else does. I remember once actually being at one set of lights and being utterly astonished that some cyclists had stopped at a red, only to then noticed further down about 30+ cyclists all being queued up by coppers and having their details taken Drivers can be stupid and miss bikes in mirrors and the like, but thats no trade off for deliberately going through dozens of red lights and ignoring roundabout procedures. I would also bet my bottom dollar a higher percentage of cyclists jump lights than drivers speed. I remember being on my bike and just being embarrassed that when I gave way to a car or something equally 'car like' that cars suddenly gave me loads of room and got thumbs up and smiles, that as a cyclist I was in the minority that took other cars seriously and followed the basics of road laws. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 That's not a fair comparison Steve. You can tell when a cyclist jumps a red light in the exact same way as you can when a driver jumps a red light. Using your comparison, you can still tell if a car is speeding using the mobile phone if you film it and then compare landmarks: That's how the CPS do it, albeit they don't usually have to rely on mobile phones. I can prove very easily that a driver is ignoring road signs telling them to stop or give way, not wearing a seat belt (easy to see at 30mph, try it!), on a mobile phone etc. It's just as simple to see the obvious things, no matter your mode of transport. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ioneabee Posted July 27, 2014 Author Share Posted July 27, 2014 crikey - I started this off as a bit of jokey / P take thread its obviously hit a nerve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldel Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 Mentioning cyclists on a petrol heads forum...! Well we have a slightly biased view of course, I am sure plenty of cycling sites have the same about 'those muppets in sports cars that waste earths resources and take up road space' - but hey! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fodder Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 Oi coldel, I'm a fat Middle aged banker.... Admittedly I don't dress in Lycra.... Well not on my bike anyway. As I said London is nuts and to be honest i thought the majority of cyclists breaking the rules would be couriers or traffic droid. I take your word for it. SteveD. How many cars do you see with a light out and they continue to flaunt it and not get penalised even when it means they blind oncoming traffic. You know feck it, let's ban everyone from using the road just in. Case they break one of the rules. Then no one gets away with it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetpilot Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 I have no issues with motorists when out on my mountain bike and yes I mean when I am on the road. I am in no rush to get to the offroad bit and give every respect to motorists, lets put it like this, they will do more damage to me than I will to them, whether they are in the right or wrong, I will not take risks with a ton and a half or more of moving metal! But here in lies the issue i believe, i am travelling slowly on road, i can stop on a dime and avoid easily, i am not in any way trying to "keep or get up my average speed" on a bike I am strapped to that cant make quick turns, hop up a kerb or bail from if necessary, just to impress your mates with a good average. The roads are a means of transport, you want to get out and improve your average, do what most do here if they actually want a nice drive, get out at 4 or 5 in the morning and home in time for breakfast without busy roads were you put yourself in danger! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevoD Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 (edited) ? Edited September 24, 2014 by StevoD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fodder Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 (edited) Yea you can tell when a car and bike run a light or go wrong way down a one way route or don't give way But what group does them things the most? My point was someone said cars break the more than bikes which maybe be right maybe wrong ,but there argument was speeding there is no obvious way from standing at side of the road if a car is doing 30 or 33 mph with no certified equipment, but I or anyone can tell a rider/drivers running red light antics blind as day so going by provable by the public crimes bikes break the law more It was me that mentioned speeding and that was based on when I'm in a car... And have my speedometer too... You can use more than one mode of transport you know EDIT. I'd like a link to your statement that cyclists break the law more than motorists please. Edited July 27, 2014 by Fodder Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevoD Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 (edited) ? Edited September 24, 2014 by StevoD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldel Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 99% of cyclists in London are commuters, not couriers - its really not that big an industry! Having done a fair bit of travelling, you only have to go to Copenhagen or the like where cycling is very common in city centres - the difference? - better roads i.e. cycle lanes - also people cycle to work in their work clothes at a safe reasonable pace, not in a yellow lycra jersey like they are up against a time trial or something. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhackyWill Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 (edited) I spend a fair bit of time in Tokyo, where people cycle along at a sedate pace on the pavement (they have wide pavements) with pedestrians, The two never have a problem, you are allowed to cycle on the road within reason, but its frowned upon, someone dressed like Lance giving it large on the streets of Tokyo wouldn't last long..!! Think the taxi drivers would sort it out with their white gloves off..This whole cycling thing is about boundaries and respect for other people.. Unfortunately the majority of cyclists in the UK have neither. :scare: Edited July 27, 2014 by WhackyWill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fodder Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 Sweeping statement there. I cycle so I have no boundaries or respect....... FFS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhackyWill Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 Sweeping statement there. I cycle so I have no boundaries or respect....... FFS I have amended it to take the minority into account. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sipar69 Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 99% of cyclists in London are commuters, not couriers - its really not that big an industry! Having done a fair bit of travelling, you only have to go to Copenhagen or the like where cycling is very common in city centres - the difference? - better roads i.e. cycle lanes - also people cycle to work in their work clothes at a safe reasonable pace, not in a yellow lycra jersey like they are up against a time trial or something. Agreed. I live near Coldel and work in the middle of London. I see the behaviour of cyclists every day and the numerous ones who run red lights are men, women, commuters, couriers, etc etc - they're all at it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetpilot Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 (edited) Sweeping statement there. I cycle so I have no boundaries or respect....... FFS I cycle too, but have no issue with the comment as from what I can see these days its true, a cyclist is certainly not as accountable as a driver and they know it, hell I know it, I was out later than I should have been the other week, I had no lights, what was I going to do, walk home with my bike or ride, I rode home very slowly on the pavement, it was only 4 miles, a police car drove past and nothing, you can be dam sure if I was in a car with no lights on the pavement I would have been stopped, is there a difference? Edited July 28, 2014 by Jetpilot 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rock_Steady Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 Basically, the nature of a bicycle being slim and easy enough to get around a town/city on, lends itself to the fact it allows you to get away with some traffic violations a lot easier than a car can. The temptation is there and is usually taken. Or imagine this situation, You're waiting at a cross junction and want to turn right, the light goes green, you indicate right and wait for a space to pass through the traffic. The traffic is thick and fast and you're still waiting when, a kind driver flashes for you to go through because they can't go any further forward without blocking the road that crosses over, you thank them and start turning into the road when taa daa!!! a cyclist comes past. They don't know that the driver ahead has flashed you to go and comes straight across and gives you the finger. It's situations like that I don't like. I'm not saying it's the cyclists fault it's just the lack of consideration and sanctimonious attitude that some have. The fact you're driving a car obviously means you don't care about the environment and that you like to beat tramps to death with a rare bird for sexual kicks. Can't stand it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevoD Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 (edited) ? Edited September 24, 2014 by StevoD 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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