Dynamic Turtle Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 (edited) Hi guys, I took a bit of a knock at Snetterton last week hitting a tyre wall (thankfully) at around 25mph after losing drift control around a corner. I had new ARBs fitted the week before and wanted to give them a workout - maybe they were too rigid! I can't blame the roll bars actually - I simply applied too much throttle and didn't let off as my drift angle increased. I am clearly not Vin Diesel but at least I'm attempting my impersonations in a more appropriate venue than the public roads. Well sometimes... Anyway the impact was bad enough to crack the front bumper, bend the wings and knock the left light out of alignment as you can see in the pics. The airbags also deployed and being punched on the nose by one of these was the most painful bit of the accident. The car is in the bodyshop now for a full refit and I'll be putting out a "wanted" ad for various components in due course as the car was completely uninsured. The weird thing however, is that the engine starts fine and revs great, and there is no CEL warning - which I'm pretty shocked about given the impact. There are no oil or coolant leaks (just the washer bottle!) and the rads/oil cooler and fans appeared to have escaped any damage. Engine temp is stable. A bit of context: The crash happened on lap 2 of a 5 lap session (my 25th lap of the day) I was gunning at full speed after a warm-up lap so the car was running hot Obviously the car stops dead after a crash and does not have time to cool down properly However, even though the CEL is off I've noticed the following things: The clutch pedal feels a fair bit heavier than before the crash The battery voltage is slightly higher upon ignition (hovering around 15.25 rather than 14.8) Oil pressure seems slightly higher than normal on ignition (around 90/100 - I don't it's ever been that high on ignition) Are these signs symptomatic of anything (lack of cool-down after a high-temp impact?) or are they just damaged sensors? Where should I look for hidden engine damage that could raise its ugly head further down the line? Should I do a complete fluid change (brakes/oil/coolant) or would this be unnecessary given that I had a P2 service 500 miles prior to the accident? Many thanks in advance for any help. DT Edited March 19, 2014 by Dynamic Turtle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhackyWill Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 That's a fair bit of damage, best person to ask would be Zmanalex. As I'm sure he will have most of the parts you need as well.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ebized Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Moved from 370 section Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
370Ad Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Firstly...did you cry? As I am pretty sure I would have! Clutch fluid could been down to the track day in general, over heating of the fluid from high temps. No idea on the other 2 unfortunately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dynamic Turtle Posted March 19, 2014 Author Share Posted March 19, 2014 Moved from 370 section (sorry!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dynamic Turtle Posted March 19, 2014 Author Share Posted March 19, 2014 That's a fair bit of damage, best person to ask would be Zmanalex. As I'm sure he will have most of the parts you need as well.. Already been on the phone to Clark re components - they're breaking a kuro zed next week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dynamic Turtle Posted March 19, 2014 Author Share Posted March 19, 2014 Firstly...did you cry? As I am pretty sure I would have! Clutch fluid could been down to the track day in general, over heating of the fluid from high temps. No idea on the other 2 unfortunately. I didn't cry - I was so f*cking angry with the zed (and myself) that I kicked the door in!! Arrgghh!! Noted re fluid temps, thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Oil and battery I wouldn't worry about. Clutch pedal could be damage to the slave/master via shock from the crash, but again I'm not convinced I'd do anything to investigate if everything else seems okay. What I would do is be very concerned about the chassis being straight, but that's something you'll only find out after you've got everything fixed and tried to do an alignment. If you feel like it, it might be a good idea to post up exactly what you have to replace and the costs involved to give others an idea of repair costs should they find themselves in a similar place, or at least they could help determine whether someone felt like taking up trackday insurance for their own trip. Massive commiserations btw, and I genuinely mean that: Tbh, there but for the grace of God go I. I've been lucky so far, but luck doesn't last forever. Just glad you're okay mate, that's the main thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dynamic Turtle Posted March 19, 2014 Author Share Posted March 19, 2014 Oil and battery I wouldn't worry about. Clutch pedal could be damage to the slave/master via shock from the crash, but again I'm not convinced I'd do anything to investigate if everything else seems okay. What I would do is be very concerned about the chassis being straight, but that's something you'll only find out after you've got everything fixed and tried to do an alignment. If you feel like it, it might be a good idea to post up exactly what you have to replace and the costs involved to give others an idea of repair costs should they find themselves in a similar place, or at least they could help determine whether someone felt like taking up trackday insurance for their own trip. Massive commiserations btw, and I genuinely mean that: Tbh, there but for the grace of God go I. I've been lucky so far, but luck doesn't last forever. Just glad you're okay mate, that's the main thing. Thanks. The irony is that I just didn't have time to arrange the insurance before going - we bought the tickets the evening before the trackday. However I will obviously be buying some in future and only going on circuits with wide run-off areas (I don't care how boring they are) and plenty of tyre wall protection around the bends. The zed really is a great car on track and can clearly protect its occupants, but stopping 1500 odd kilos of momentum once you touch the grass is always going to be difficult; brakes don't work on the green stuff. I should also say that the Snetterton administration team and paramedics were absolutely first class from start to finish - no blame, anger, accusations or costs faced at my end. Just a super friendly, supportive and efficient attitude. Re damage I will get quotes up as and when I get the final bill. I selected a local bodyshop who recovered it for free and who also has a 350z bumper in stock, both of which have saved a fair bit of cash. I think I'm looking at roughly £1500 cash for all the labour, bodywork and airbag bits at the moment, but this doesn't include potential damage to more serious stuff which has yet to raise its head (like the engine and chassis as you say) The main expense so far has been the hire car. £98 a week for 2014 1 litre fiesta - a very dangerous car with no grip, brakes, torque or steering feel and massive understeer over 20mph. However it runs on a combination of air and magic and is currently returning 4,600mpg. I still hate every minute driving that wet sponge of a car though... DT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Don't feel too bad mate, you might not have done anything even with run off: Mate of mine who I sold the VXR220 almost came a-cropper at Anglesey, when he tried to take Turn 1 and the car kept going straight over the grass. Only the fact the track was clear the other side meant he had time to find grip and stop. I also know of one guy who managed to drive into a marshall's post at the same track...! It happens to the best of us, don't sweat it. Even if you were in a 500kg Caterham, you wouldn't have stopped it. Like you say, once you're on the green stuff you ain't stopping for anything. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhackyWill Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Don't worry Jonathan Palmer will send you the bill for his grass..!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dynamic Turtle Posted March 19, 2014 Author Share Posted March 19, 2014 Yes we had a warning about track and grass damage during the briefing. However they (apparently) only levy fines if it's due to wantonly aggressive driving and sheer stupidity. If you behave yourself all day and come a cropper due to an unfortunate error of judgement, they're fine about it. They were just relieved that I was OK. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Lol, that letter is brilliant! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cs2000 Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Haha what a letter! I imagine white signs with red letters stuck on the corners "KEEP OFF THE GRASS" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dynamic Turtle Posted April 7, 2014 Author Share Posted April 7, 2014 OK so I thought I'd post an update now that the car is back on the road, a month after the crash. Big thanks to the MSV / Palmer team at Snetterton who were brilliant and Keith at Breckland Bodytech in Attleborough who did a slow but great job in the circumstances. Costs (approx but inc vat): Radiator shroud £120 (nissan oem price!). Breaker/used stuff: front bumper £80, misc bits of plastic (grommets, brackets, plates etc) £250, full airbag/belts/srs loom £320 Labour (inc reshape and spray of bonnet and wings, airbag refits + loads of other stuff) £1400 Miserable 1 litre fiesta hire car for 28 days: £365 Misc train tickets: £200 So roughly £2750 out of pocket, not including a gigantic amount of time and hassle to get everything sorted and the costs of the ill-fated trackday itself (£300). Insurance would have been around £80 premium with an £800 excess so I would strongly advise anyone going on track to sort this out. I had a fairly minor impact (30mph ish,) and was very lucky not to bend the chassis or cause any drivetrain damage. As for the car, following a 1-month idle period it was very rough on start-up. However it markedly improved after a 200 mile test drive around norfolk's finest bendy bits and now she's 98% there. The power steering hydraulics have a little bit of air so the steering is slightly heavier than normal (but at least it's consistently heavy rather than taking in more air). the gearbox oils also feel more viscous and probably needs replacing - it took noticeably longer for it to loosen up than usual. Oil pressure and batt voltages have thankfully normalised as these were elevated before. Engine temp was rocksteady and nominal as before. I had Abbey fit some Whiteline ARBs a couple of weeks before the trackday and am not sure I like the additional stiffness. Yes the turn-in is pointier and there's less body roll, but it has come with too much loss of traction and floatiness from the rear end. The car handles like an 80s 911 now and it's frankly, rather scary. I don't like bricking myself every time I take a roundabout at 30mph and feel the backend step out (and this is with TCS engaged). I should also point out that it's running grippy new MPSS (which are great but let's see how long they last compared to the 15k mile RE050s). I'm not sure I'll keep the ARBs because it's just too unnerving and after several failed attempts at drifting I've finally realised that I'm not Vincent Diesel. And let me just re-iterate that saving the car was the right thing to do, regardless of cost (and it still needs more cosmetic work on the alloys and tesco dings!). We shouldn't be breaking these future classics up at the pace we currently are because they'll be sorely missed when they're gone. DT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMballistic Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 Good write up DT and thanks for sharing your experience. I agree with you that these car's shouldn't be broken up but the more people that do that doesn't bother me as it just makes used parts cheaper & easier to come by plus our Zeds that are still on the road become rarer still. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Definitely shows how worthwhile track insurance can be, just a shame that it had to be proven this way. With regards to the ARBs, what settings are they on? And did Abbey re-do your geo while you were there to adjust for this? Given you have more than average adjustability now, you should be able to tune your car to how you want it to handle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dynamic Turtle Posted April 8, 2014 Author Share Posted April 8, 2014 (edited) Yep I had a full geo afterwards and eibach rear camber arms to replace the OEM arms. I should state however, that I'm running OEM ARB drop links (albeit with poly bushes all around) so I think the adjustability options are somewhat limited. I didn't fancy paying an extra £200 for the eibach jobbies... Edited April 8, 2014 by Dynamic Turtle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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