The Bounty Bar Kid Posted December 19, 2013 Author Share Posted December 19, 2013 How did ekona become the tyre know all??? Not sure but I think the title could be up for grabs soon Shotgun! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren-B Posted December 19, 2013 Share Posted December 19, 2013 How did ekona become the tyre know all??? He's always been the tyre Guru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Tyres Posted December 19, 2013 Share Posted December 19, 2013 Winter Tyres have extra Sipes for grip, and are made of a different compound of rubber to allow them to grip at low temperatures. Same as at the other end a track slick won't grip unless warmed up. We were always taught that the best way to explain the sipes working is the same when you roll a snowball. The grip you are getting is effectively "snow on snow" like when rolling a snow ball up. Winter tyres in the UK have only really started to come into play in the last 3-5 years really and we didn't believe the hype much either. Then we went to the GY DU test, where they drove 2 cars up a ski slope ( ) and we couldn't believe the difference. The company I used to work for now has all is vans swapped on to them at Winter. I think the problem is here is you're comparing them to the Super Sports, which as I'm sure you'll be aware are very grippy tyres. Yes if it goes below 7 degrees, maybe even to 2 degrees in dry conditions they will out perform a winter tyre....but, they will start to get out of there element as the temperature lowers and the conditions worsen. The downside obviously is the cost, sometimes even having to buy a spare set of alloys. I think the decision boils down to your personal needs.....why buy a more expensive set of tyres, is it really worth it in the uk? Do you use your car as a weekend car, and the occasional trip to the shops? You probably don't need Winter tyres on then. Most experienced drivers are fine driving on snow... you just be sensible and drive within your limits. I'll be honest, I won't be putting winter tyres on my Audi, it barely goes anywhere so the cost wouldn't be effect. I've driven in the snow before, even in a L200 in RWD which was huge fun lol. Is your car vitally important to your day to day work and you need to be places (emergency doctor, vet etc) then maybe you should put them on, It's always a difficult decision, it's easy in europe as they have snow a lot more than us, we have it a few weeks a year? Maybe better to be safe if you're driving family around etc. Just my opinions Not really any help at all lol! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dblock Posted December 19, 2013 Share Posted December 19, 2013 Winter Tyres have extra Sipes for grip, and are made of a different compound of rubber to allow them to grip at low temperatures. Same as at the other end a track slick won't grip unless warmed up. We were always taught that the best way to explain the sipes working is the same when you roll a snowball. The grip you are getting is effectively "snow on snow" like when rolling a snow ball up. Winter tyres in the UK have only really started to come into play in the last 3-5 years really and we didn't believe the hype much either. Then we went to the GY DU test, where they drove 2 cars up a ski slope ( ) and we couldn't believe the difference. The company I used to work for now has all is vans swapped on to them at Winter. I think the problem is here is you're comparing them to the Super Sports, which as I'm sure you'll be aware are very grippy tyres. Yes if it goes below 7 degrees, maybe even to 2 degrees in dry conditions they will out perform a winter tyre....but, they will start to get out of there element as the temperature lowers and the conditions worsen. The downside obviously is the cost, sometimes even having to buy a spare set of alloys. I think the decision boils down to your personal needs.....why buy a more expensive set of tyres, is it really worth it in the uk? Do you use your car as a weekend car, and the occasional trip to the shops? You probably don't need Winter tyres on then. Most experienced drivers are fine driving on snow... you just be sensible and drive within your limits. I'll be honest, I won't be putting winter tyres on my Audi, it barely goes anywhere so the cost wouldn't be effect. I've driven in the snow before, even in a L200 in RWD which was huge fun lol. Is your car vitally important to your day to day work and you need to be places (emergency doctor, vet etc) then maybe you should put them on, It's always a difficult decision, it's easy in europe as they have snow a lot more than us, we have it a few weeks a year? Maybe better to be safe if you're driving family around etc. Just my opinions Not really any help at all lol! My point with winter tyres are they are safer at cold temperatures. For me I have to get around so I want and need the safty of being able to get around safely. The car that my nieces are in to go nursey has winter tyres as again I want the safety for them. I don't NEED winter tyres but a few years ago we had that cold snap in april. I wished I had my winter tyres so much. With winter tyres you can potentially and thats the key word potentially save money on tyres since they swap when it gets cold and winters seem to wear quite well. Save you money as your car will have much much more control and therefore you won't slide into anything or another car. It's safer. Also it will save you time. A normal journey when snowing fairly heavily with winter tyres with double just so I'm being safe. That journey will become tiring, dangerous and take maybe 10x the time it would have taken normally. For me its a no brainer. BUT if you live in the SAAAAFFF you might not get it as bad or as cold as up here so it really is just a few days a year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stutopia Posted December 19, 2013 Share Posted December 19, 2013 I'm considering some winters, but I don't get buying winter rims to go with them. Is it purely for the ease at which you can change tyres at home as temp fluctuates or simply to protect your summer rims from salty roads? Is there another reason I haven't considered? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dblock Posted December 19, 2013 Share Posted December 19, 2013 I'm considering some winters, but I don't get buying winter rims to go with them. Is it purely for the ease at which you can change tyres at home as temp fluctuates or simply to protect your summer rims from salty roads? Is there another reason I haven't considered? In some ways its cheaper since you can get some 18 non rays cheap and it saves you the £40+ for swapping the tyres over every time. So once on and once off is £80 already. Thats just for one year so for 2 years its going to be £160+ in tyre fitting costs alone and you lose out on all the other benefits. Secondly you can protect your rays or nice alloys from salt, corrosion and damage. Thirdly yes that way you can whip on and off as you please. Lets say we get a heat wave in january (i wish) then it's no problem to change them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BulletMagnet Posted December 19, 2013 Share Posted December 19, 2013 I'm considering some winters, but I don't get buying winter rims to go with them. Is it purely for the ease at which you can change tyres at home as temp fluctuates or simply to protect your summer rims from salty roads? Is there another reason I haven't considered? Had the 18" Rays when I bought the car, so when I bought my Volks, naturally the Rays became my winter set Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stutopia Posted December 20, 2013 Share Posted December 20, 2013 Cheers Dblock, BM, makes sense. I wondered if there was another technical reason I'd missed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Tyres Posted December 20, 2013 Share Posted December 20, 2013 Also some cars with different sized fronts and rears can't actually get a matching set! Most BMW owners on 19's have to drop to 18's to find a set IIRC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bounty Bar Kid Posted December 20, 2013 Author Share Posted December 20, 2013 Winter Tyres have extra Sipes for grip, and are made of a different compound of rubber to allow them to grip at low temperatures. Same as at the other end a track slick won't grip unless warmed up. We were always taught that the best way to explain the sipes working is the same when you roll a snowball. The grip you are getting is effectively "snow on snow" like when rolling a snow ball up. Winter tyres in the UK have only really started to come into play in the last 3-5 years really and we didn't believe the hype much either. Then we went to the GY DU test, where they drove 2 cars up a ski slope ( ) and we couldn't believe the difference. The company I used to work for now has all is vans swapped on to them at Winter. I think the problem is here is you're comparing them to the Super Sports, which as I'm sure you'll be aware are very grippy tyres. Yes if it goes below 7 degrees, maybe even to 2 degrees in dry conditions they will out perform a winter tyre....but, they will start to get out of there element as the temperature lowers and the conditions worsen. The downside obviously is the cost, sometimes even having to buy a spare set of alloys. I think the decision boils down to your personal needs.....why buy a more expensive set of tyres, is it really worth it in the uk? Do you use your car as a weekend car, and the occasional trip to the shops? You probably don't need Winter tyres on then. Most experienced drivers are fine driving on snow... you just be sensible and drive within your limits. I'll be honest, I won't be putting winter tyres on my Audi, it barely goes anywhere so the cost wouldn't be effect. I've driven in the snow before, even in a L200 in RWD which was huge fun lol. Is your car vitally important to your day to day work and you need to be places (emergency doctor, vet etc) then maybe you should put them on, It's always a difficult decision, it's easy in europe as they have snow a lot more than us, we have it a few weeks a year? Maybe better to be safe if you're driving family around etc. Just my opinions Not really any help at all lol! My point with winter tyres are they are safer at cold temperatures. For me I have to get around so I want and need the safty of being able to get around safely. The car that my nieces are in to go nursey has winter tyres as again I want the safety for them. I don't NEED winter tyres but a few years ago we had that cold snap in april. I wished I had my winter tyres so much. With winter tyres you can potentially and thats the key word potentially save money on tyres since they swap when it gets cold and winters seem to wear quite well. Save you money as your car will have much much more control and therefore you won't slide into anything or another car. It's safer. Also it will save you time. A normal journey when snowing fairly heavily with winter tyres with double just so I'm being safe. That journey will become tiring, dangerous and take maybe 10x the time it would have taken normally. For me its a no brainer. BUT if you live in the SAAAAFFF you might not get it as bad or as cold as up here so it really is just a few days a year. That was my other point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bounty Bar Kid Posted December 20, 2013 Author Share Posted December 20, 2013 How did ekona become the tyre know all??? He's always been the tyre Guru Not any more Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bounty Bar Kid Posted December 20, 2013 Author Share Posted December 20, 2013 Also some cars with different sized fronts and rears can't actually get a matching set! Most BMW owners on 19's have to drop to 18's to find a set IIRC I think the Michelin pilot alpin pa4 negates that issue by being available in two different tread patterns. Assymmetrical and directional. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cs2000 Posted December 20, 2013 Share Posted December 20, 2013 You can get all weather tyres too, probably what those are, but I doubt theyre quite as good as full winters or full summer tyres. Just a half-way house type of thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bounty Bar Kid Posted December 20, 2013 Author Share Posted December 20, 2013 You can get all weather tyres too, probably what those are, but I doubt theyre quite as good as full winters or full summer tyres. Just a half-way house type of thing. What tyres are you referring to? The ones I said? The Michelin pilot alpin pa4? they are cold weather / winter tyres They are just the new version of my Michelin pilot alpin pa3s Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spursmaddave Posted December 20, 2013 Share Posted December 20, 2013 Also some cars with different sized fronts and rears can't actually get a matching set! Most BMW owners on 19's have to drop to 18's to find a set IIRC I looked at getting winters for my Jag as you said a matching set all round on 18's, but just didn't have the spare cash and to be honest complete overkill as I live nr Bluewater & work nr Lakeside on one of the busiest commuter/shopper routes in the UK so if that was not cleared & gritted then no point going anywhere anyway!!! Sent from the golf club... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bounty Bar Kid Posted March 16, 2014 Author Share Posted March 16, 2014 Update... Winter tyres are now down to 6-7mm tread after two winters use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spursmaddave Posted March 16, 2014 Share Posted March 16, 2014 Winter tyres are basically useless when down to less than 4mm I believe, what winter did you need them for this year Dip? Sent from the golf club... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted March 16, 2014 Share Posted March 16, 2014 And how many miles? Far more useful than number of winters used. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bounty Bar Kid Posted March 16, 2014 Author Share Posted March 16, 2014 Winter tyres are basically useless when down to less than 4mm I believe, what winter did you need them for this year Dip? Sent from the golf club... 4mm for snow. Still fine for cold weather Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bounty Bar Kid Posted March 16, 2014 Author Share Posted March 16, 2014 And how many miles? Far more useful than number of winters used. About 12,000 so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spursmaddave Posted March 16, 2014 Share Posted March 16, 2014 Must have been a lot of miles this year in 6+ degrees, I would rather have summers than winters when it is borderline Sent from the golf club... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bounty Bar Kid Posted March 16, 2014 Author Share Posted March 16, 2014 Each to their own. I'm just putting up my opinion and experience for others to consider. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spursmaddave Posted March 16, 2014 Share Posted March 16, 2014 Each to their own. I'm just putting up my opinion and experience for others to consider. Trouble is you can't trust the weather can you Sent from the golf club... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bounty Bar Kid Posted March 17, 2014 Author Share Posted March 17, 2014 I travel the same roads day in and out every day. Some b roads at "speed". I know that the winters gave me superior grip than the summers would of at certain times. Would rather than rather not IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisB Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 ^^ I agree. BBK you are not alone Winters work fine during this transitional warm period, so it does not matter if they stay on temporarily above 7C, (our winter tyres speed rating is V, so perfectly OK for normal speed road commuting), but they work undoubtedly better than summer tyres in cold times. Test cars for reference are my zed and her Civic 2.2 with its 'interesting' diesel turbo torque wave. We both have big commutes. Both myself and wife have had practical experience of enhanced grip in the cold last year. We live in a mildly hilly area, and have both completed journeys without drama compared to carnage around us. The only time when the envelope is completely collapsed is black ice. Frost and snow performance is better. Everyone should always drive to the conditions, but a tyre's job is one of feedback, grip and ultimately safety, and these are enhanced with winter tyres in cold conditions. Seems silly to keep summer ditch finders on in the winter if you can afford to swap. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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