kinglozzer Posted August 8, 2013 Share Posted August 8, 2013 Hi all, Probably a quick few questions for most of you, but I know next to nothing about suspension! I want what most want: to lower my car (daily driver), probably around 30mm, without compromising the handling of course. So, my questions: - Lowering springs = fixed height. Coilovers = adjustable height/harshness. Correct? - Assuming above is correct, do you need wheel alignment or anything done when adjusting ride height? - Any recommended brands? I see H&R and BC mentioned a lot on here. - My Zed's done around 45,000 miles, presumably on the original suspension, will something else give way if I throw new parts on it? Any and all advice greatly appreciated Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MITZ@CougarStore Posted August 8, 2013 Share Posted August 8, 2013 If you're after a static drop then I'd go with the Eibach springs we do at 30mm drop... If you want to dictate the height and damping, coilovers is what you need, the BC Racing that we've been offering for the last 5 years are excellent... Drop us a call or PM and we'll be happy to help... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arran Posted August 8, 2013 Share Posted August 8, 2013 Don't waste your money on springs imo, get coilovers but you'll need camber arms for either springs or coilovers, I have Hsd coilovers and eibach camber arms and am seriously impressed with the setup, it felt absolutely perfect on the nurburgring last month Both coilovers whichever you choice and camber kit can be got from CS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KyleR Posted August 9, 2013 Share Posted August 9, 2013 What he ^^^ said. However, you'll only need adjustable arms if you lower it more than about 20mm. So if you go Eibach springs, you'll need them, if you go coilovers, you may not depending how low you go. I just have springs at the moment (K-Sport 30mm drop) with eibach/SPC arms and I'm ok with the handling. It doesn't make it any worse and maybe marginally better, however with a coilover set up you'll be able to adjust more to suit your driving style. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spursmaddave Posted August 9, 2013 Share Posted August 9, 2013 I wouldn't lower a daily driver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberfella Posted August 9, 2013 Share Posted August 9, 2013 Advanced Suspension Setup, Toe? Camber? Spring Rates? Learn here! Front spring rate increase: More under steer; increase in proportional weight transfer to the front when rear wheel rate is not increased; reduces front traction when rear rate is not changed. Usable adjustment: 150-600 lbs/in Symptoms of too much adjustment: terminal under steer; front of car hops in corners; excessive wheel spin on inside front tire on FF cars. Front spring rate decrease: Less under steer; decreases proportional weight transfer to the front when rear wheel rate is not increased; increases front traction when rear rate is not changed. Usable adjustment: 150-600 lbs/in Symptoms of to much adjustment: Too much over steer; over steer then under steer if spring is so soft that the car bottoms out on lean, car bottoms out excessively with a jolting ride. Rear spring rate increase: More over steer; increase in proportional weight transfer to the rear when front wheel rate is not increased; increases rear traction when front rate is not changed. Usable range: 100-600 lbs/in Symptoms of too much adjustment: too much over steer; sidestep hop in corners; twitchy; pretty scary. Rear spring rate decrease: Less over steer: decreases proportional weight transfer to the rear when front wheel rate is not changed; increases rear traction when front rate is not changed Usable range: 100-600 lbs/in Symptoms of too much adjustment: car under steers; if way to soft car under steers then over steers as car bottoms out on lean; car bottoms out excessively with a jolting ride. Front anti-roll bar stiffer: more under steer Usable range: none to 1.25 inches in diameter Symptoms of to much adjustment: terminal under steer; lifts inside front tire off the ground witch can cause massive wheel spin on FF cars; also not good for most effective tire usage as inside tire is now doing nothing. Front anti-roll bar softer: less under steer Usable range: none to 1.25 inches in diameter Symptoms of to much adjustment: overstate scary; more like fun Rear anti-roll bar stiffer: more over steer Usable range: none to 1 inch in diameter Symptoms of too much adjustment: Big-time over steer. Can cause inside rear tire to lift off the ground. Rear anti-roll bar softer: less over steer Usable range: none to 1 inch in diameter Symptoms of to much adjustment: under steer; slow and boring Front tire pressure higher: less under steer by reducing slip angels on most tires Usable adjustment: up to 55psi hot Symptoms of too much adjustment: no traction- tire crowned so more under steer; adds wheel spin in FF cars; jarring ride; center of tire wears out Front tire pressure lower: more under steer by increasing slip angles on most tires Usable adjustment: not less then 20psi Symptoms of too much adjustment: edges of tire wear quickly because tire is folding over; feels mushy; tires chunk because low pressure means heat build up. Rear tire pressure higher: less over steer by reducing slip angles on most tires Usable range: up to 45psi hot Symptoms of too much adjustment: no traction—tire is crowned so more over steer; bad wheel spin on FR cars; jarring ride; center of tire wears out. Rear tire pressure lower: more over steer by incresing slip angles on most tires. Usable range: not less then 20psi Symptoms of too much adjustment: edges of tire wear quickly because tire is folding over; feels mushy; tires chunk because low pressure means heat build up More negative camber front: less under steer because of better lateral traction as tread is flatter on the ground under side load. Usable range: up to 3.5 degrees negative Symptoms of too much adjustment: poor braking; car is road crown sensitive; twitchy; front tires wear on inside edge More negative camber rear: less over steer because of better lateral traction as tread is flatter on the ground under side load. More rear grip Usable range: up to 2.5 degrees negative Symptoms of too much adjustment: more over steer; car feels twitchy in back; tires wear out on inside edge; less breakaway warning when limit is exceeded. Ride height to low (typical beginner mistake): car is twitchy with unpredictable dynamics. Bump steer make you life miserable. Usable range: usually 1.5-2.0 inches lower then stock unless car has been modified to go lower. Symptoms of too much adjustment: everything that could possibly go wrong: sudden over/under steer; twitchy due to bump steer; very harsh ride; premature tire wear. Toe in – front: car is stable going straight. Turn in is average Usable range: 0-1/8th inch Symptoms of too much adjustment: car has slow twitchiness under braking; feels odd; kills outside edge of tires Toe out – front: Car turns in well; works pretty well on FF car as they tend to toe-in under load. Usable range: 0-1/4 inch Symptoms of too much adjustment: Car is really twitchy under braking; car wanders on straight road; kills inside edge of tire Toe in – rear: car is less likely to over steer when the throttle is lifted Usable range: 0-1/8th inch Symptoms of too much adjustment: weird, slow, rocking movement in back; feels slow but still unstable; wears outside edge of tires. Toe out – rear: Helps car rotate useful in low speed and slalom courses; very common on FF pro rally cars. Usable range: 0-1/8th inch Symptoms of too much adjustment: not to good for street driving; causes lift throttle over steer; makes violent side to side rocking motions in the rear; tie wears on inside more. Positive front caster: helps stability; suspension will get more negative camber when turning; reducing positive caster reduces steering effort. (Negative caster is not usable) Usable range: 4-9 degrees positive Symptoms of too much adjustment: can increase under steer especially in cars with wide low-profile tires. Can increase steering effort. Single adjustable shock stiffer: Better turn in; better transient response; causes slower onset of over/under steer by slowing weight transfer depending on what end of the car is adjusted. Symptoms of too much adjustment: suspension becomes unresponsive; ride gets harsh; car skips over bumps, loosing traction; Causes a big delay in weight transfer resulting in strange handling like under steer then late corner stage over steer. Single adjustable shock softer: slower transient response; quicker onset of over/under steer Symptoms of too much adjustment: car oscillates due to under dampened spring motion, like a boat. Car gets twitchy in turns. Feels unstable. PARAMETER TO INCREASE UNDERSTEER TO INCREASE OVERSTEER Front Tire Pressure Lower Higher Rear Tire Pressure Higher Lower Front Tire Width Smaller Larger Rear Tire Width Larger Smaller Front Camber More Positive More Negative Rear Camber More Negative More Positive Front Springs Stiffer Softer Rear Springs Softer Stiffer Front Sway Bar Stiffer Softer Rear Sway Bar Softer Stiffer Have fun tuning your suspension. Use Toe and Camber to your advantage! Even Tire pressure helps. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberfella Posted August 9, 2013 Share Posted August 9, 2013 (edited) If you're after a static drop then I'd go with the Eibach springs we do at 30mm drop... If you want to dictate the height and damping, coilovers is what you need, the BC Racing that we've been offering for the last 5 years are excellent... Drop us a call or PM and we'll be happy to help... I've recently had a few suspension upgrades and had them fitted via Cougar Store / All Fours Garage (one and the same) in Leicester, namely Adjustable rear camber arms and toe bolts and front and rear adjustable anti-roll bars (car was already running on lower springs). I got re-aligned at the nearby TyresGalore alignment shop. I received nothing less than absolutely superb service by both companies and would highly recommend them for friendly and very competent service. As for the results of the upgrades - a phenomenal improvement to bodyroll, accuracy and cornering far in excess of what I was expecting. I chose softest settings for the front sway bar and middle setting on the rear, but do your own research before you decide what to go for. It's always easily adjustable though). I'm so impressed I'm completing the work already done with whiteline drop links and some superpro poly bushes to replace the now ageing oem ones. I can't wait to take the results to the track for a shakedown. Edited August 9, 2013 by cyberfella 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberfella Posted August 16, 2013 Share Posted August 16, 2013 Whiteline drop links now fitted and no squeaks, knocks or creaking. Just a lower, straighter, stiffer, flatter, grippier car. Thanks CS! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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