What would you have done?

[Ekona]

A slightly random one from me for a sunny Monday morning, but it's been playing on my mind a bit since Friday so I thought I'd see what the general consensus is.

 

 

Coming out of my road on Friday morning, I turn right to head towards the main road at the bottom to make a left turn to carry on with my commute to work. The junction itself is situated on a blind corner of the main road, so while there's always the potential for accidents there I've never seen one yet. Until Friday, where as I came down the road towards the junction there was a person laying on the other side of the road, clearly having just been clumped by something.

 

He was in the classic 'just been runover' pose with legs and arms all folded up, but seemed conscious. There was a lady standing over him talking to him, although what she was saying I had no idea. There were a two further guys close by, one on the phone to (I presume) the ambulance. It must've happened only 30secs or so before I got to the scene. This was all happening to my right so I had a clear view as I drove past, made the left turn and carried on to work.

 

 

Did I do the right thing, or should I have stopped?

 

 

I think I was right to carry on, but I'm not so sure. He wasn't bleeding that I could see, and there was someone with him. There was already a person calling the ambulance so I couldn't have helped there, and there was another person available to direct traffic or assist as needed. There was nowhere to stop and pull over, so if I'd have stopped then it wouldn've blocked the road up possibly hindering an ambulance getting there, although it would've meant that no other vehicles could've driven past very close to the injured party. I have first aid training, and I have no idea if anyone else there did or not. What more I could've done, I don't know.

 

I still can't decide if I was right to carry on or not. Yes, I had a meeting very first thing that I couldn't really miss, but in the grand scheme of saving another human beings life then it absolutely could've waited. I may well have just ended up in the way due to the location, and there were spare people there to help, but should I at least have tried to stop or offer help? Or was I right just to get out of the way and not clutter it up with an extra person + vehicle?

[Sarnie]

I think you should have stopped mate, especially if your trained in First Aid..........

[Flex]

Mate,

 

If there were ample people there then I think you were right to carry on as you say you would just be adding to the numbers. Unless you're training in CPR etc then what could you have added.

 

Different if you had witnessed something.

 

Forget about it, buy a poppy and move on!

[Flex]

I think you should have stopped mate, especially if your trained in First Aid..........

Missed that bit.

[Ekona]

When I say trained in FA, I mean the very basic one day courses you do for work, not anything like popping a tube into the throat or anything.

[Sarnie]

May have been more than the people standing over him watching him choke on his tongue etc.....

 

Not saying your a bad person for driving on, but if there was one thing I could do to potentially help I'd do it. Even if that one thing was just rolling them into the correct position, putting a coat over them or phoning their husband/wife etc.

 

I hope you enjoy hell

[Drayvn]

I don't think you did anything wrong, if you know how to deal with a road collision involving a pedestrian them by all means you should be rushing over there, but if you don't know how to deal with that why involve yourself when you can do nothing about it.

 

Clearly there were people already attending to him and all you would have done was stand there watching him. To him, in that situation would probably get him more agitated that everyone is crowding him. I was in a road accident when i was on my bike and while i was laying on the ground there were masses of people lining the pavement like i was some sort of amusement, i couldn't care less about them but people that have been in accidents aren't something people should be crowding around and staring to see what has happened with some morbid curiosity.

 

Every time i see an accident or someone who has been hurt and is on the floor i make sure to give a good look to see if they are being cared for, maybe even ask someone if the emergency services have been called and go on my merry way, there is nothing else i can do for them! Especially if they are being cared for by other people already, and it does make it harder for the ambulance crews to get to the accident too.

[Stew]

You did nothing wrong however I would have stopped (sod the traffic) just to check everything was under control. Not everyone can cope under stress.

[Bockaaarck]

I don't think you did anything wrong, if you know how to deal with a road collision involving a pedestrian them by all means you should be rushing over there, but if you don't know how to deal with that why involve yourself when you can do nothing about it.

 

Clearly there were people already attending to him and all you would have done was stand there watching him. To him, in that situation would probably get him more agitated that everyone is crowding him. I was in a road accident when i was on my bike and while i was laying on the ground there were masses of people lining the pavement like i was some sort of amusement, i couldn't care less about them but people that have been in accidents aren't something people should be crowding around and staring to see what has happened with some morbid curiosity.

 

Every time i see an accident or someone who has been hurt and is on the floor i make sure to give a good look to see if they are being cared for, maybe even ask someone if the emergency services have been called and go on my merry way, there is nothing else i can do for them! Especially if they are being cared for by other people already, and it does make it harder for the ambulance crews to get to the accident too.

 

 

+1 on this. You might feel better if you'd have wound the window down and asked "...can I help, is everything ok?.." and acted appropriately depending on the response. However you made the decision not too because it appeared there were people looking after and caring for the person. I don't think you should beat yourself up over it. As Drayvn has said, I will always offer help if I think its needed and if it's required I will give it, if not I'll not get in their way and carry on with my journey.

[Ekona]

Interesting comments, thanks chaps.

 

I guess it is the fact that I drove past so easily that disturbed me, as I wouldn't normally do so. I don't know if I weighed up all the pros and cons in my head very quickly to make that decision or whether I just carried on because I wasn't quite awake enough. Winding the window down is probably exactly what I should've done, no idea why I didn't.

[Fodder]

Hmmm difficult one; I had agreed up until I read the first aid bit. I think if you have any kind of training you are morally obliged to offer assistance.... I did have a very long conversation (alcohol induced) with my brother in law a few years back about this however he does have extensive FA training due to his job.

 

I dont so under those circumstances i probably would have done the same, that said if the people present had been flapping I would have stopped and checked..... and promptly fainted

 

I wouldnt beat yourself up about it, it sounds like it was all under control and it's amazing how much detail you can take in without realising so I dont think you really did drive by so easily.

[Ricey]

Gypsies getting ready to car jack you I reckon

 

Unless the was one lonesome person with him I would have bounced as well and I'm first aid trained to the same standard as you.

[Chris`I]

At the least I would have stopped to make sure they had the basics covered up to the level you are trained for (ie victim is as well cared for as possible, scene is under control and emergency services have been called), and if that was all covered then I would have jogged on happy it was under control and so not to block the traffic. Being that I am a little more trained in first aid than most (being a PADI Rescue Diver), I tend to take control of the scene unless there is someone there who is already demonstrating that they are on the case and make sure everything is ok. Fortunately I've not actually had to administer any first aid as such as most cases were just a case of monitoring the injured until paramedics arrived and then give them the facts.

 

I've been witness to several RTAs in the past and the varietyl of help and understanding (or lack there of) from bystanders is staggering. Don't assume in a group of people at an accident one of them knows what they are doing. I came across one guy on the A33 that had fitted at the wheel and crashed his car. There was a group of at least 5 there, most just staring and no one actually knew what they were doing or had called for help. I ended up having to direct one to call the ambulance (which he then handed over to me), one to watch and guide the traffic (and keep it clear for the ambulance), and one to fetch a blanket from her car which she hadnt thought would be useful to keep the chap warm. All while I opened the door, switched off the engine and made the car safe, and check the guys breathing and circulation which none of the others had thought to do! Thankfully the chap was breathing and bar a small knock to the head was ok once he'd stopped fitting, albeit very disorientated.

[T.C]

Hi , just joined the forums so catching up on older threads. I think Chris l hits it on the head really, some good points. Here's one I bet no one knows, did you know if you do not help someone in a situation like this you COULD be prosecuted. You have a duty as a citizen to assist, you live and learn eh? Just one of those randoms laws you learn in training.

[Ekona]

Umm, pretty sure that's France you're thinking of. If I remember my law A-level correctly, no such law exists here although there have always been talks about whether one should be introduced. That said, if you do know the exact law in question I'd love to be proved wrong, I like facts like that that no-one knows

[T.C]

Hi Ekona, sounds like we are rather similar, I used to love those type of random questions about law. it IS this country. If I still had my "manual of guidance" ( not sure if you ever got to read one) I could show you. If I ever come across it I will indeed point u in the right direction.

Kind Regards.

[theheff]

I thought more of you....... I thought youd have taken the oppurtunity to run over and give him the kiss of life. No tongues!

 

If hes with people that are tending to him thats all i would worry about. Doing first aid once doesnt make you any good at it. And if you mess it up your open to all sorts of stuff. Your good intentions will mean nothing. Its an company insurance thing in most cases. Like security guards at supermarkets.

The last thing the ambulance would want wen they turned up is loads of people stood round and in there way.

[stuarty]

I'm positive that if you saw the victim and there was know one else at the scene you would have stopped and assisted

Being a basic first aider, you are equipped to give the very basic treatment ( which can save lives). But as the victim was already awake and there was others at the scene you did the correct thing.

Ive worked in the NHS for nearly 20 years and I know professionals, such as Doctors and Nurses who would drive by and not assist for fear of a malpractice suit. I know this is hard to believe but its true.

I know of two Doctors who have been accussed of Medical negligence as a result of stopping to help someone in public. It' terrible but its the times we live in!

[T.C]

I'm positive that if you saw the victim and there was know one else at the scene you would have stopped and assisted

Being a basic first aider, you are equipped to give the very basic treatment ( which can save lives). But as the victim was already awake and there was others at the scene you did the correct thing.

Ive worked in the NHS for nearly 20 years and I know professionals, such as Doctors and Nurses who would drive by and not assist for fear of a malpractice suit. I know this is hard to believe but its true.

I know of two Doctors who have been accussed of Medical negligence as a result of stopping to help someone in public. It' terrible but its the times we live in!

Yep I know that to be true too, I lived with a nurse for 5 years, she said exactly the same thing.

[Mrs Buster]

Basic first aid may cause more harm than good. If you had stopped and put the chap in the recovery position, you may have caused more damage/paralysis if he had injured his neck/back.

 

As there were others there you probably would only get in the way - although winding down the window and checking probably would have made you feel better.

[scubapics]

At the least I would have stopped to make sure they had the basics covered up to the level you are trained for (ie victim is as well cared for as possible, scene is under control and emergency services have been called), and if that was all covered then I would have jogged on happy it was under control and so not to block the traffic. Being that I am a little more trained in first aid than most (being a PADI Rescue Diver), I tend to take control of the scene unless there is someone there who is already demonstrating that they are on the case and make sure everything is ok. Fortunately I've not actually had to administer any first aid as such as most cases were just a case of monitoring the injured until paramedics arrived and then give them the facts.

 

I've been witness to several RTAs in the past and the varietyl of help and understanding (or lack there of) from bystanders is staggering. Don't assume in a group of people at an accident one of them knows what they are doing. I came across one guy on the A33 that had fitted at the wheel and crashed his car. There was a group of at least 5 there, most just staring and no one actually knew what they were doing or had called for help. I ended up having to direct one to call the ambulance (which he then handed over to me), one to watch and guide the traffic (and keep it clear for the ambulance), and one to fetch a blanket from her car which she hadnt thought would be useful to keep the chap warm. All while I opened the door, switched off the engine and made the car safe, and check the guys breathing and circulation which none of the others had thought to do! Thankfully the chap was breathing and bar a small knock to the head was ok once he'd stopped fitting, albeit very disorientated.

 

Have to agree with this. I too am rescue diver trained which goes far beyond basic first aid and CPR including scene of accident management. I too have managed an RTA scene and whilst there were plenty of people around they needed managing to prevent more harm. No one had called an ambulance. No one realises that you need one ambulance per patient. No one thinks to call the police to manage the traffic and control the scene. No one thinks to request a fire appliance to cut someone out of a car who may have spinal injuries. Getting this all done early saves valuable time and saves lives. Don't wait for the ambulance crew to turn up and do it all. Better to call them all then just the one.

 

I had to stop one chap from yanking one the door frame to try to pull the driver out of the car who was quite calm but clearly in shock and was best left in place but with someone providing reassurance that help was on the way.

 

I also had a colleague direct traffic away and another call the ambulance etc whilst a pet shop owner brought out first aid kit and attended to the passenger who had collapsed half way out of the door screaming for her child who was on the back seat quite well but no belt etc!

 

Another colleague was first aid trained for work just turned around and went back to work. Goodness knows how she would cope with an accident in the office!

 

It was great experience for me and the one thing it showed was that whilst people may well be shown to be attending to the accident, on the whole they haven't a clue what they are doing and are either causing more harm than good or delaying important first aid which includes calling for help.

 

You don't need to be a scuba diver to do the PADI emergency first responder course and it only takes a day or two half days to do.

 

A33 - which part? I drive Wellington monument to Chineham everyday since June this year.