Newbie Considering a 350Z coming from a Porsche

[Tain]

Hi all.

 

I've been considering new cars for a month or so now. I currently own an 06 reg Porsche 911 Carrera 4S but I'm thinking that when my second yeah of insurance runs out in about 6-7 months time I will downgrade to save money. This car costs a bomb to maintain and the depreciation is very painful!!!

 

Coming from the Porsche I know it will be hard to choose something I will enjoy as much. But I have the Zed on my mind and I think it will tick my boxes as a relatively cheap, reliable and fun car to drive. However I have never owned a turbo car and I'm not sure whether this bug will need to be itched for all the tuning potential.

 

I want something that:

 

Is reliable and cheap-ish to run.

Looks good/stylish.

Is enjoyable and firm to drive.

Has plenty of grunt.

Most importantly it needs to sound great!

 

I had a V6 TT before my 4S and I miss the V6 noise I think. As much as I love my 4WD and grip, I think I will enjoy owning a RWD car like the 350Z.

 

My budget will be between £10k-£15K. From what I've read and heard already the 313 is definitely the one to aim for. If I'm wrong please advise otherwise?

 

I have a few questions. Are there any major problems/faults with this car which I might not be aware of? An unknown one to many about Porsches is that they have bor scoring issues which can ultimately result in engine failure. So I was hoping there is nothing like this in relation to the 350?

 

What are the running costs like in comparison to my car? (Currently I get 15mpg. Services cost between £500-£800. Brakes are about £1100 for a full set-up all round. Tyres are £250 each at the front and £350 each at the rear for Bridgestones).

 

Is there anything I should look out for and aim to get? Upgrades or specs I might not be aware of?

 

Do you think I'll be happy owning this car coming from the Porsche?

 

Ultimately when it gets closer to the time I would happily exchange a great passenger ride in the 4S for one in a Zed if someone is local to me and willing. Maybe even swap keys. (I'm from Croydon in Surrey).

 

So yeah I think I have covered all basis. If anyone has any advice or suggestions please let me know.

 

I will more than likely pop on and off this forum for the next few months. Thanks for any help.

 

Martin.

[Ekona]

I went the other way, from Zed to 997.2 C2S. Before I start, I will say that I love the Zed and would have another one tomorrow, so this is all in comparison to a car that costs more than twice as much:

 

 

The Zed feels a heavy car. The 911 is practically the same weight, especially the 4S models, but they hide their weight very well having it all out the back. A 911 can be an incredibly precise tool, but a 350 is a far more blunt instrument and you'll never hide the mass over the nose. The steering is very weighty and turn in is rarely what you'd consider sharp in comparison.

 

The engine is far from characterful, although the 309 HR is much better than an early car as you can really wring its neck and it will respond. A good exhaust is a must-have on a Zed, it really is. If you focus on the suspension side of things you can get a Zed to handle as a sports car should, and IMHO this is a better direction than chasing bhp. The caveat of the paragraph above still applies.

 

There are no terminal issues with the Zed in the same way the M97 has the bores/IMS worries, so no fear there. Servicing costs are a little lower, budget about £300 per year, but fuel will be worse. Brakes and tyres are very similar, expect to pay the same as what you are now. It won't be much cheaper overall than the 911, which ironically makes the Porker a bargain in that aspect.

 

The seating position is worse in the Zed so longer cruises aren't as easily eaten up, and the blunt front end can make placing the nose down a country lane awkward compared to the 911. The interior is a much worse place to be, but at least it's easy to sort out the ICE in the Zed compared with trying to do anything with the PCM2!

 

 

And despite all that, it's still the only car I'd consider dropping down to from the 911. Aside from the running costs, it fulfills every one of your criteria perfectly and I can guarantee it's a car you'll learn to appreciate in a whole different way to your current beast.

[The Bounty Bar Kid]

You're more than welcome to see mine. We occasionally have a few on selection to see every now and then when some of us meet up. Which I kinda fortnightly ATM.

[The Bounty Bar Kid]

Oh and

[Wasso]

I wouldn't say the seating is bad in the Zed, on the contrary, I've done over 5,000 miles in Europe in roughly 20 days. Never had a problem, sit back relax let the car do the talking.

 

I agree on the narrow country lanes, but then I'm lowered so I have to look out for holes and width of the road.

 

Oh and by the way

[The Bounty Bar Kid]

If you come visit me and my home boys ( can't believe I used that ) we can show you a stock HR, a slightly modded HR ( mine) and a supercharged HR. Oh and a lovely selection of de engined zeds. Which if you have an itch to go turbo, can be done for less than on a HR plus lower car buying cost.

[Neilp]

My bro had a c4s late 996 model and although it's stunning I preferred the drive in the zed as it just wasn't as engineered and precise as the Porsche. He also thought the zed was a spectacular car for the cash.

 

The 997 c4s is a completely different kettle of fish compared to the 996. I wouldn't say I thought the 996 c4s was any quicker than my car (infact, we know it wasn't) but I have spent alot on mines. I imagine there would be a fair bit of performance distance to a standard 350z. The HR is a good engine an can produce big n/a numbers but as said before there isn't as much modding potential as the earlier cars. Regardless of engine you need to go for a facelift car from 2006 onwards as these have a much nicer cabin and wont feel as much of a let down in comparison to the 911.

[Ricey]

The engine is far from characterful.

 

wash your mouth out your dirty man! Its a beautiful sounding engine!

[Sarnie]

but fuel will be worse.

 

Worse than 15mpg??? Unless your on a track I don't think anyone would be seeing less than 15mpg in a zed. Most are well into the mid to high 20 mpg's. Mine was at 24mpg over a full 12 months.........

[Tain]

Thanks for the replies guys. Ekona you are on 911UK aren't you? I recognise the name from a post recently.

 

Everything you said is kind of what I was expecting to hear to be honest. I mean I know it wont compare to the 911 but I am glad you've said it would still be a good step down etc.

 

I also see what you mean about the Porsche seeming like a bargain with similar running costs. However because of the huge price difference of the car (say 10k to 35k) I just can't justify the 5k+ a year depreciation for something that I've only done 5k miles in over 18 months.

 

I don't really have any intention of chasing power gains. It would simply be a weekend car to just enjoy motoring. The only places I drive to are restaurants/pubs and mates houses anyway. Maybe the odd weekend blast here and there.

 

If I could get a minter for around 10-15k then I think I'd be happy to keep a Zed for a good few years and cash in the Porsche with some change in the bank. I have never driven one though. I've driven a 370z and I have to admit I wasn't that impressed but I think that was just a bad experience, I didn't get to open her up much. That one didn't make a noise as nice as 350z's I've heard either.

 

Sounds like I would definitely need the 313 though.

 

I'll build on my knowledge base for the meantime. Maybe I'll go to a dealer and get a test drive one weekend. But as I say it wont be for another 6-7 months anyway before anything happens. I'm just preparing early as I normally always jump into cars and buy the first one I see...Hopefully a members car will pop up around that time which I know will have been looked after

 

Bounty Kid where about in Coulsdon are you from?

 

Cheers

[DannyBoy]

I think Ekona is your man for this comparison, but I have to add my protest to to the 'uncharacterful engine' comment. I'm sure it won't feel as refined as the Porsche motor, but once you slap a decent exhaust on and maybe a few choice bolt-on mods it really comes to life and is a highlight of the car IMO. Ride comfort and seating position are personal things, but I have to agree with Wasso in that I've taken many long (whole day) trips in the Zed and always been comfortable. You'll definitely notice the Japanese interior quality, while I don't like Porsche interiors (a bit bland/unimaginative) there's no doubt they put Nissan to shame on quality of materials and lack of creaks and squeaks. Another thing I suspect you'd notice is the transmission. I've never driven a 911 but I have driven several Boxsters and I recall the transmission being quite light and precise. The transmission in the Zed (particularly pre '06) could charitably be called agricultural.

 

The Zed is a great car, and one I see myself keeping until it dies, but comparing it to a car that was in a totally different league when new is always going to show up some weak points.

 

DB

[Sam]

[Ricey]

The best way to describe a Zed is that if it was a human it would be a builder who is quite ripped up but not from being a vain gym go'er but from all the manual labour he's been undertaking, as such he's a decent footballer where he plays in the 'solid midfielder' role (torque) and is described by team mates as having a sweet left foot (handles well). He is happily married with 2 kids (the kind of car you can't help but like) but stubbornly refuses to go it alone self employed and make his fortune (engine has more to give).......instead he continues to spend frugally (can't afford snazzy interior) whilst toiling in hardwork and blood for an underpaying employer who he believes will eventually reward him for his loyalty and graft (possible mods or he will be traded in for a newer model). He has learned these things from his equally hardworking parents (Mr & Mrs 300zx) and hopes to pass it on to his son Butch (370z) who is already showing that he will surpass the 'salt of the Earth' status that his dad has achieved.

 

He's the kind of car that you could take home to your mum.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The only problem is he has a clicking hip (axle) from the building work and a raging drinking problem (petrol)

[Jay]

The best way to describe a Zed is that if it was a human it would be a builder who is quite ripped up but not from being a vain gym go'er but from all the manual labour he's been undertaking, as such he's a decent footballer where he plays in the 'solid midfielder' role (torque) and is described by team mates as having a sweet left foot (handles well). He is happily married with 2 kids (the kind of car you can't help but like) but stubbornly refuses to go it alone self employed and make his fortune (engine has more to give).......instead he continues to spend frugally (can't afford snazzy interior) whilst toiling in hardwork and blood for an underpaying employer who he believes will eventually reward him for his loyalty and graft (possible mods or he will be traded in for a newer model). He has learned these things from his equally hardworking parents (Mr & Mrs 300zx) and hopes to pass it on to his son Butch (370z) who is already showing that he will surpass the 'salt of the Earth' status that his dad has achieved.

 

He's the kind of car that you could take home to your mum.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The only problem is he has a clicking hip (axle) from the building work and a raging drinking problem (petrol)

 

 

Ricey... there are times that I really worry about you mate

[ioneabee]

Butch though is definately a rising up an coming youngster with aspirations of having a sliver spoon in his mouth

[Ian]

[rabbitstew]

Is reliable and cheap-ish to run.

Looks good/stylish.

Is enjoyable and firm to drive.

Has plenty of grunt.

Most importantly it needs to sound great!

 

What are the running costs like in comparison to my car? (Currently I get 15mpg. Services cost between £500-£800. Brakes are about £1100 for a full set-up all round. Tyres are £250 at the front and £350 at the rear for Bridgestones).

 

Hi and welcome to the forum. As a 313 owner for the last 18 months, ive just sold mine so can give you a good break down of the running costs.

 

When you workout the total running costs including tax, insurance, mot, tyres, servicing, everything.. mine was costing me around £250 a month all in. That`s assuming you dont have a big expense like a clutch etc. I fitted new set of tyres on mine and it was £600 all around for Falkens. Bridgestones would have been nearly £1000. Servicing varys from £170 for minor to £400 for a major. However, its well within DIY capability and I did my last service myself which came to around £35 for the parts.

 

MPG depends on how you drive. 15mpg if its a weekend toy or a better 26mpg if you use it as a daily 25000 mile a year commuting vehicle like I did.

 

Brakes depends on what you go for. If you go OEM its going to be cheaper, but I went for DS2500 pads which were £250 all around.

 

You mention depreciation... well that depends on where you buy from and where you sell. I bought mine from a main dealer and then sold it to another main dealer 18 months later, and lost £6500 in the process. Which ever way you look at it, thats quite a bit of depreciation there, something like a 30% drop. If I had bought / sold privately I would probably have only lost £4k judging from prices, but the 2nd hand market is very hard atm for cars like the zed.

 

Fun factor? Whilst its not all about 0-60, whats your porsche do 0-60 in? 5 seconds? The 313 is about 5.5 or 5.8 I think, so not too far off so when you put your foot down it will go. As standard I felt the HR sounded great, very sporty and with an aftermarket exhaust it was even better. The driving experience you need to try as if its all down to personal taste really whether you like it or not. The bits I didnt like was that I felt the zed was a bit too heavy & the suspension was a bit too soft compared to other cars id been used to. Also the TC had a tendency to cut in until the tyres were fully warmed up. But the plus points was that the steering was brilliant and the actual on the road performance against other cars was great. I was very often surprised at just how quick the zed was and could keep up with cars which on paper should been much quicker.

 

All in all I found owning a zed a really good fun experience. One of the biggest factors with zeds which was one of the reasons I went for one over an s2000 or a Porsche or a BMW Z4 is that they are very rare. The 313 Roadster I had was just one of around 250 in the country and during my 18 months of ownership I only ever saw 1 other one. And in fact I could probably count on 1 hand the number of 350z`s I actually saw on the road during that time. Its one of those cars which is so rare people actually stop and stare at you. I had complete strangers coming over and saying "nice car mate" to me, which I hadnt had in a very long time. So you have a kinda of exclusivity when you own one.

 

If I was you id try a couple out and see what you think. For your £15k budget theres a lot of cars you could get, so you really are spoilt for choice!

[Tain]

Some interesting points there thanks. A good friend of mine is a mechanic so I would give it to him for all servicing etc rather than using the main dealer. But to try and preserve the value of my Porsche I've had to stick with dealer stamps which is very costly.

 

Tyres sound like they are going to be just as expensive really. However I only do about 4k miles a year so it's not a huge deal. I'm sure standard brakes will be fine for road use which is all I plan for it.

 

You lost a lot on your car, but buying from a dealer and selling back to one I would have expected that to be fair.

 

0-60 on the Porsche is 4.8 seconds, which is probably a year round realistic figure because of the 4WD. However, not once have I actually performed a 0-60 sprint so it doesn't matter too much for me. I normally just use first gear to pull off then floor it in 2nd gear if I want to get away fast. 2nd and 3rd in the Porsche are viscously quick. That's where the fun begins and that's where I'd want there to be as little change as possible in an ideal world.

 

How does it compare to a zed: 226BHP per tonne. 296 lb-ft Torque.

 

I like that they are rare but what mainly does it for me is the muscular looks and the exhaust note!!

 

I know there are plenty of other cars out there for the budget but I cannot think of much else to be honest. I was considering VX220s. But wont be very ideal for taking the Mrs out for dinner etc. I hate the noise of M3s also!!

[Ricey]

Get one - if for no better reason than there are loads of meets to attend and other zedmongs to hang around with.

 

Its a car that you can't help but love.............there are about 3 people on here who actually didn't like the Zed and I'm pretty sure they probably also like marmite and can lick their own eyebrow.

[Ekona]

The engine is far from characterful.

 

wash your mouth out your dirty man! Its a beautiful sounding engine!

It's really not, especially stock. Not in comparison to the grumbly roar of the M97 in the OPs 911.

 

I wouldn't say the seating is bad in the Zed, on the contrary, I've done over 5,000 miles in Europe in roughly 20 days. Never had a problem, sit back relax let the car do the talking.

It's not bad at all, it's just not as good. Both are excellent in the grand scheme of things.

 

but fuel will be worse.

 

Worse than 15mpg??? Unless your on a track I don't think anyone would be seeing less than 15mpg in a zed. Most are well into the mid to high 20 mpg's. Mine was at 24mpg over a full 12 months.........

My bad, I didn't see where he wrote 15mpg It'll be the same then, as 15mpg on a 997 is a car that's being used properly, and if you use the 350Z in the same fashion the fuel economy will be at those levels, if not a tad lower.

 

Thanks for the replies guys. Ekona you are on 911UK aren't you? I recognise the name from a post recently.

I am indeed, I get around everywhere, no-one can ever get shot of me!

 

 

 

0-60 isn't a reasonable comparison really as Tain says, because it's when you get moving that the extra shove really comes into play. Look at the 30-100 times for both cars and there will be a significant difference, and the 911 will keep pulling where the Zed has stopped. I had 140mph out of my Zed at the back straight of the Ring and it simply stopped pulling, but my 911 will see 170mph and still be tugging onwards. Again, I'm not trying to wee on fried potatoes here, as the Zed is more than enough for the roads in the UK. It's more that to try and say that the performance is roughly the same simply isn't true.

 

2nd on a 309HR is still quick, it's just not as mind-bendingly quick as the 997. It will definitely pin you back in your seat though, and more importantly put a smile on your face. If anything it's a more rev-happy engine than the M97, which makes it seem quicker than it actually is.

[Builder49]

The best way to describe a Zed is that if it was a human it would be a builder who is quite ripped up but not from being a vain gym go'er but from all the manual labour he's been undertaking

 

 

 

 

Blimey, you been on that site I put my pic up on Ricey ????

 

 

 

 

[Ricey]

The engine is far from characterful.

 

wash your mouth out your dirty man! Its a beautiful sounding engine!

It's really not, especially stock. Not in comparison to the grumbly roar of the M97 in the OPs 911.

 

said whilst licking his own eyebrow

[Ekona]

[rtbiscuit]

there are about 3 people on here who actually didn't like the Zed and I'm pretty sure they probably also like marmite and can lick their own eyebrow.

 

that would be me then

 

it wasn't that i didn't like the zed, its the fact that its looks wrote checks its body couldn't cash. i suppose my expectations were to high. but i could never get the kind of sound out of it i'd hoped for. its not the best sounding V6 in the world but exhausts help. its one of the few cars the seating position did my hips in.

 

if i took my preconceptions out of the picture the zed is a nice car, but i'd rather have the porsche. if i had to down grade form the porsche and wanted to maintain the pure driver focus i'd be looking at the M3's. if your wanting a fun weekend car i'd be looking at the TVR's. great sounding V8's stunning lookers and rare.

 

the one thing the zed did give me was some great new friends. and a forum that i haven't left since changing cars twice since the zed.

[rabbitstew]

Some interesting points there thanks. A good friend of mine is a mechanic so I would give it to him for all servicing etc rather than using the main dealer. But to try and preserve the value of my Porsche I've had to stick with dealer stamps which is very costly.

 

Tyres sound like they are going to be just as expensive really. However I only do about 4k miles a year so it's not a huge deal. I'm sure standard brakes will be fine for road use which is all I plan for it.

 

You lost a lot on your car, but buying from a dealer and selling back to one I would have expected that to be fair.

 

0-60 on the Porsche is 4.8 seconds, which is probably a year round realistic figure because of the 4WD. However, not once have I actually performed a 0-60 sprint so it doesn't matter too much for me. I normally just use first gear to pull off then floor it in 2nd gear if I want to get away fast. 2nd and 3rd in the Porsche are viscously quick. That's where the fun begins and that's where I'd want there to be as little change as possible in an ideal world.

 

How does it compare to a zed: 226BHP per tonne. 296 lb-ft Torque.

 

I like that they are rare but what mainly does it for me is the muscular looks and the exhaust note!!

 

I know there are plenty of other cars out there for the budget but I cannot think of much else to be honest. I was considering VX220s. But wont be very ideal for taking the Mrs out for dinner etc. I hate the noise of M3s also!!

 

 

If your only doing 4k a year then the tyres will last a very long time. Your right, for me its all about in gear performance and 2nd & 3rd on the zed are pretty good and by then your doing well over legal speeds anyway. 1st and 2nd gear on the zed are very restricted by the ecu in that it delivers the power slowly rather than give you it all at once, in order to try and help traction.

 

Looking at porsches website your porsche weighs about 100kg less than a zed, has 325bhp compared to the zeds 309bhp and 273lb ft compared to the 268lb ft the zed. So, the porsche has the advantage in those figures!