Why are NHS hospitals so poo?

[Ricey]

General debate and spleen venting please

 

Having just spent a week in the countess of Chester Im almost astonished as to how hospitals can be so bad , disorganised, dirty and generally crap when we pump so much money there way (granted I have no idea how much they actually need as opposed to what they get but it seems like they get inordinate amounts of money).

 

I'm assuming then usual suspects (germany, Spain, Italy, France) are all miles better? Why are we always left so far behind!!!

 

Free health care for all.....well yes but only if your prepared to run the risk of contracting mrsa, norovirus and the possibility that youll do jail time after beating the irritating, boring , snoring **** in the next bed to death with your slipper by the time you leave.

 

Whilst we're on the subject of free it cost my mum and carla about 40 quid in parking charges to come and visit me....the nurses said they also have to pay this if they want to park on site and I had to pay 16 quid for access to 8 tv channels for 4 days........free my arse!

[Lexx]

My dislike of the NHS is well documented within my family after my ex-fiance almost died in 2009.

 

My solution - Bupa.

Granted, it costs yet more money on top of NI payment, but the NHS is something I will never be able to change. By paying for Bupa, I've managed to at least take some control of my own health car.

[Jay]

I have to agree with lexx. I pay for Bupa and its sooo much better.

[buster]

try spending 5 weeks in hospital m8.......

 

 

i had to endure this 2 years ago in august . to be honest the staff work really hard and i think your find that its due to the goverment stripping the @*!# out of the nhs that leave it so poor.

[AK350Z]

As the vote to basically privatise parts of the NHS was just pushed through the other week, I would advise everyone to seriously consider getting some private cover, as the service as we or our parents knew it is effectively over.

[Vik54]

In answer to your question Paul - because five successive governments have f*cked it up that's why They all seem to think they can apply sudo -market principles to a caring profession and as a result the folks that want to do their jobs well and make a difference to people's health and wellbeing spend their days tied up in red tape

[Sam Mcgoo]

Iv'e never had a bad experience with the NHS. Although I've not been admitted for about 10 years I am still a regular outpatient and have spent my fair share of time admitted in the past.

 

I've had bupa cover for the last 5 years (through work) but have never felt the need to use it.

[Ricey]

My dislike of the NHS is well documented within my family after my ex-fiance almost died in 2009.

 

My solution - Bupa.

Granted, it costs yet more money on top of NI payment, but the NHS is something I will never be able to change. By paying for Bupa, I've managed to at least take some control of my own health car.

 

I've got bupa (or whatever the Norwich union equivalent is) but that doesn't come into play if your admitted through a&e. Once your admitted your fooked.....private cant be invoked.

[Beavis]

My dad was in intensive care last year for 3 week's last June (collapsed and stopped breathing at home)!. Every single one of them on that ward (MIU WARD 11) at the North Staffs was an absolute star. He then had 8 chemotherapy session's and 20 days of Radiotherapy at the North Staffs Cancer Unit for Lymphoma . Thanks to the excellent treament he recieved from all of those on the intensive care ward, the cancer ward and those on the Hematology ward he is back at home and making excellent progress. No complaints from me.

 

And he will be with me at Chester races on the 9th May

[Ricey]

In answer to your question Paul - because five successive governments have f*cked it up that's why They all seem to think they can apply sudo -market principles to a caring profession and as a result the folks that want to do their jobs well and make a difference to people's health and wellbeing spend their days tied up in red tape

 

That figures but surely the other European countries have this kind of crap......are we really run that differently!! (I have no interest in politics so im a bit ignorant to our plight).

[planetsurfer2]

Move to Switzerland.

I pay £130 a month for compulsory health insurance as a 50 year old.

Avoid MRSA and the joys of the insane pill pushing medical practices in the UK. Run away

[Vik54]

Other European countries do not have anywhere near the amount of free health care that we do!

[Ricey]

Other European countries do not have anywhere near the amount of free health care that we do!

 

Are they all a bit like America then? what's an example of what I wouldn't get in say,Germany that I would here?

[planetsurfer2]

What free health care? you pay for it through general taxes.

it's only free in the sense you have already paid for it.

[DannyBoy]

Surely the basic issue boils down to the fact that the NHS gets it's cash from the governement, whether it's terrible or not. We may all think it's awful (seems like most on here do at least) but we pay for it anyway because if we don't then we go to prison (where we'd probably get better health care). Private healthcare is better principally because it has to be to survive. The management of the NHS can get away with running the most inefficient and badly organised healthcare system in western Europe because they get paid regardless and therefore have little incentive to do otherwise.

 

I'd like to clarify I am firmly in favour of the principles of the NHS, just not the way it requires 4 people on 100K salaries to decide what colour the toilet seats need to be.

 

DB

[Daryl]

I must admit,iv not had any experience in the last 15 years of the NHS directly,but recently,one of my nans had a stroke,which she has now fully recovered from,but while she was in hospital recovering, they discovered bow cancer. She had her operation last week,and today was released from hospital,not back to full health,but getting there. She is nearly 82!!

 

My other nan has been in hospital recently after a fall,and although she is now in a care home for rehabilitation, (which is actually very nice) she was and has been well looked after by the system. To be honest,id be happy to pay as I use,which is what happens in the USA i believe. Though i have been lucky and never broken anything,or had a serious illness other than Asthma as a child.

I get the Norwich union cover through work,but regardless,id still rather pay for private than use the NHS.

[Squee]

Yikes. And the Countess is meant to be one of the better ones and is highly regarded throughout the UK apparently

 

Hope you on the mend fella!

 

S.

[liam42whu]

My last experience of a hospital was very good, although I have to admit the food was very bad.....

However treatment wise was was great, they fixed what was wrong and its still fixed. I believe that one of the reasons why soooooo many people come to live in Britain is because of our NHS .

[zDan]

From some limited experience I'd say both NHS and Bupa have good and bad sides. The most competent, experienced and dedicated doctors and nurses I've seen were on the NHS - but I've also seen issues in NHS hospitals that would make me hesitate going there.

 

With Bupa you get more "comfort" but you don't get a lot more choice, as I found out their consultant fee cover can be abysmal - sometimes just about 30% of some consultant's fees. (it's still probably the best in the market, but still can be a shock). And the system of limits - for instance cover is reduced if you have more than one intervention in one go - makes it even worse. The T&C's are very wooly, you only really find how much cover you get when you get a problem, their fee schedule is now a national secret apparently. Otherwise the hospital I've seen was OK (can't say it was cleaner than NHS though, but accommodation was better, less crowded, staff less stressed, etc).

 

Comparing the two I would still go with Bupa and try to get the best NHS consultants through it, even if it means taking a hit financially. As long as one can afford it.

 

I think there is something basically wrong with the system in the UK, when neither the public system is supported enough to maintain a consistent decent service throughout the country and the private system feels like a patch on the public one and not something you can see as a real alternative. And I can't really figure out why there is still so much bureaucracy and mistrust when switching between the two systems.

[Michael robinson]

I think it depends where you go really as my family has had a good and bad experiances in nhs hospitals

 

Experiance 1 bad -

Newcastle freeman hospital - full of ****ing scum they left my gran to die in a side room in her own @*!# and didn't feed her cause she was unable to tick the food menu, they were rough with her every time they moved her and basically didnt give a flying **** about her she was just a number to them

In the end we had her removed from the hospital to a private centre and with the extra help, care and positive attitude she was happier and died with abit dignity ie not covered in @*!# !!!!

 

Experiance 2 good -

Queen Elizabeth Hospital -  when my dad had 2 stroks and a hart attack they couldn't do enough for him every thing was approached in a positive manner, the place was kept immaculate and all equipment looked brand new, Also no matter what they made sure his needs were met and he was comfortable, Couldn't fault the hole process . He is now back to him self and 100%

 

I agree about the prices of the parking and the tv's

we got around the tv part by taking in my iPad for him so he could watch stuff online

[rtbiscuit]

i can't say my 2 week say in ipswich was that great either. the ultra sound scan i was meant to get within 24 hours to findout if i had apendicitis took 3 days. the results for them which meant i could eat something which were meant to be in 2 hours took 3 days on the second set. they now deal with the issue infront of them and not underlying issues. so for instance if my apendix had reptured i would have been rushed straight in. but because i was still breathing i got left to it.

 

my knee is fubar, but because i can still walk on it i get told i can have 1 physio session. even though i've been in phsyio on and off for 10 years. they won't actually fix my knee until i'm completely crippled.

 

I would say the front line staff in NHS hospitals are bloody great. the nurses who looked after me were lovely. but sadly they were understaffed and over worked.

 

as for it being free; its only free if you don't pay any taxes. so i get to pay for my crap service with lots of taxes, while the rest of my money is spent helping chavs pop babies out like rabbits etc.

 

the heiracy structures the same as the post office an upside down pyramid. to many chiefs and not enough indians.

[yankeesiter]

Other European countries do not have anywhere near the amount of free health care that we do!

 

Are they all a bit like America then? what's an example of what I wouldn't get in say,Germany that I would here?

 

France is excellent for health care but then they pay a lot of taxes. When they go for medical treatment or get prescriptions, they may pay a percentage of the costs but then claim them back through private insurance. I've been in hospital there a couple of times and can't speak highly enough of them as I can't speak highly enough of the treatment I've recently had in Norwich.

 

Other than that, you can go to America. They have excellent doctors and hospitals if you want to take a chance on whether or not your private insurance will pay up which I understand can cost around $800 per couple per month.

[Greekman]

In answer to your question Paul - because five successive governments have f*cked it up that's why They all seem to think they can apply sudo -market principles to a caring profession and as a result the folks that want to do their jobs well and make a difference to people's health and wellbeing spend their days tied up in red tape

 

As above. It's all about statistics and targets. I worked for the nhs and now I am a private dentist for the reason that managers and the company profit was interfering with the quality of my work. I am sorry but the nhs will never change because of the way it is run. The doctors and consultants are most of the time the same nhs/private. It can even be the same person holding 2 positions! What is different is the mentality and sometimes the quality of the materials.

I need to inform you all that the private sector however is changing rapidly thanks to what is called CQC or care quality commission. It will soon be regulating everything that has to do with human healthcare from hospitals to care homes. I won't comment on it as there is no democracy in this country and I could be risking my license to practice, I will point out only that the same rules, regulations and standards are applied to both a private and an nhs dental practice lets say.

One example...an ex social worker working for the CQC now comes to my private Dental practice for inspection. One of the points she quickly picks up!

- well if you allow guide dogs in the practice, where is your dog poo bin? (true example but not my practice). Not record keeping, not materials used, not techniques and success rates nothing like that....dog poo bin, fire extinguisher 10 not 12 inches from the floor, marked dirty tool box regardless what the nurse is using it for (she is an ex social worker, she doesn't know what a dirty flat plastic looks like bless her), she doesn't care how many phone calls I take from home from patients, she doesn't care how quickly I see my emergencies, she doesn't care how many people leave the practice pain free.

That's what lowers the standard of care....because a 40k a year manager (for the nhs as said above it will be 3 100k a year) will have to dedicate most of his time sorting irrelevant things out instead of checking whether the nurses hand sanitation or the dentists record keeping is good.

Grrrrr I managed to upset myself now

[Fodder]

I had the pleasure of spending a month in the Countess when I was 17, went in with a pretty nast broken leg and was lucky to keep my foot, I did contract Pseudomonas (google it)though which was only spotted by the student nurse cleaning my wounds.

 

The staff didnt explain to me what was going on, just put me in isolation and started deep cleaning anywhere I'd been including shutting down the theaters I'd been in. Very scary.

 

I'm also allergic to tetanus which is all over my records and while in the isolation room they decided to give me a little injection, I asked what it was and was told it was a pain killer. Spring forward 30 minutes and I was in severe discomfort, even my eye lids had lumps on them and all my joints swollen. It turns out they thought i would have grown out of my allergy

 

Anyway that was 20 years ago and to be fair their A&E department were superb a few years back when my sister was admitted, sadly she passed away but the staff were amazing.

 

That said, I use Bupa whenever I can...

 

Oh And Ricy, check your T&C's of your health cover, you will probably find you can claim back a daily allowance even though you were admitted to an NHS hospital.

[ds2000]

My ex g/f was a nurse and worked so hard, along with all her colleagues between the Shrews and Staffs hospitals. The people on the ground are amazing.

 

It boils down to the government and management; lets think back to when the NHS was founded, essentially it was for patching people up and sending them on their way, peg legs and all. Now they have incredible machinery, advanced techniques, specialist departments and save thousands of lives every year..... all for free (well - NI). Staffing cuts, budgetary cuts, bad management and overcrowding unfortunately dilute what is essentially one of the strongest (free) healthcare systems in the world