Dyno results chat thread

[MattG]

Do you guys at Abbey have any 06+ airboxes lying around so you can try and replicate my results?

 

Yes I have a couple of 06' air boxes , once my UK car is ready to go , I will try one out.

 

But if you have a remap I am sure you get a few more ponies.

 

Reason I ask about number of runs as we find the 1/2nd runs will show a gain then the car will not allow car to run with full map figures i.e timing degree,s figures. You see dyno figures a fair bit down on the 1/2nd runs , your find your need 6/8 runs to get a proper figure on a dyno.

 

 

Mark

 

I plan to get an Uprev remap done once I've installed the high flow cats, MD plenum spacer and possibly a MREV2 as well.

 

I saw the guy from Motordyne saying something similar to you about the dyno thing on My350z.com. He was getting variations as much as 10BHP without changing anything. It seems that the ECU is a law unto itself really without a proper remap.

 

I've pretty much assumed that any gains I've seen on the dyno are going to be slowly taken back by the girly ECU although at the moment it still feels punchier than before, especially at motorway speeds.

[Ian]

Do you guys at Abbey have any 06+ airboxes lying around so you can try and replicate my results?

 

Yes I have a couple of 06' air boxes , once my UK car is ready to go , I will try one out.

 

But if you have a remap I am sure you get a few more ponies.

 

Reason I ask about number of runs as we find the 1/2nd runs will show a gain then the car will not allow car to run with full map figures i.e timing degree,s figures. You see dyno figures a fair bit down on the 1/2nd runs , your find your need 6/8 runs to get a proper figure on a dyno.

 

 

Mark

 

I plan to get an Uprev remap done once I've installed the high flow cats, MD plenum spacer and possibly a MREV2 as well.

 

I saw the guy from Motordyne saying something similar to you about the dyno thing on My350z.com. He was getting variations as much as 10BHP without changing anything. It seems that the ECU is a law unto itself really without a proper remap.

 

I've pretty much assumed that any gains I've seen on the dyno are going to be slowly taken back by the girly ECU although at the moment it still feels punchier than before, especially at motorway speeds.

 

Mrev2 is for revup engines not DE

[MattG]

Mrev2 is for revup engines not DE

 

That's what I thought too but I've been doing some research recently and it doesn't seem that is the case. Whilst the MREV was just a DE lower plenum and hence a pointless mod for pre 06 cars, the MREV2 is a DE lower plenum that has had some porting work done to it and is supposed to be of benefit even on DE engines. From the graphs I've seen the I think situation is as follows:

 

REV-UP with MREV2 = Better mid range but worse top end than stock.

REV-UP with MREV2 and plenum spacer = Better mid range and better top end than stock (or at least no loss).

 

DE with plenum spacer or MREV2 = Decent improvement across the curve, especially mid range. Motordyne say that if you're only going to do one or the other then the MREV2 is the way to go.

DE with plenum spacer and MREV2 = Better results than just one or the other but no where near double the effect. The main benefit seems to be peak power delivered over a slightly wider area at the top end. Apparently further gains can be released via a remap.

 

Here's what Motordyne say about the MREV2 on the DE:

 

"When used with on the non-REVUP engine, the gains are very similar to that of the 5/16" spacer but the MREV 2 Manifold will show a slightly lower peak value, with a slightly higher average value and a slightly higher TQ value. Overall, MREV 2 Manifold provides "area under the curve" and is the highest gain plenum mod available."

 

So the MREV2 is of benefit on the DE, arguably more so than a plenum spacer, but if you combine them you're reaching a point of diminishing returns.

 

This thread has lots of info:

 

http://my350z.com/forum/intake-exhaust/ ... pacer.html

[IanS16]

I'll see if I can get spme pics of my ported lower plenum.

 

The thing is.. I don't remember ever removing the plenum chamber on my car but I know I've see it

[Mark@Abbey m/s]

It seems that the ECU is a law unto itself really without a proper remap

 

Agree the cars defintely need a remap , a few figures nee dchanging on the feed back maps and we can tweak the ignition map as well

 

've pretty much assumed that any gains I've seen on the dyno are going to be slowly taken back by the girly ECU although at the moment it still feels punchier than before, especially at motorway speeds

 

Wouldn't call it girly , just a lot more intelligent than us lot .

 

 

Re the Mrev on a DE motor , got to be worth a try. But I have some idea,s re tuning these cars;

 

I feel for a Stage1 DE car I would go for the following

 

06 Airbox with a HKS filter

Berks De-cats

Motordyne XYZ Y pipe with either silencer or CAT fitted

Stock exhaust ( I feel this will flows enough air)

UPREV reflash.

 

The above set up I feel with give the most gain ( this will become a package deal from me)

 

Then I would fit headers and possibly a system ( weather your stock system falls aparts or you just want something a little more noisy) and a 5/16 spacer and Ignen filter kit and a map tweak , this I feel will give over 300bhp @ the flywheel with a big gain in mid-range torque.Might be worth try a Mrev on the above kit to see if it is worth trying.

 

Also might be worth trying a lower manifold spacer one of these;

 

http://www.motordyneengineering.com/ima ... cer180.jpg

 

We find lenghtening the intake length will increase torque.

 

Then I feel we really need to get into the motor to get anymore gains if we want to stay N/A or bolt a S/C kit on fit larger injectors/fuel pump and we should see 400bhp flywheel pretty easily.

 

Mark

[MattG]

I feel for a Stage1 DE car I would go for the following

 

06 Airbox with a HKS filter

Berks De-cats

Motordyne XYZ Y pipe with either silencer or CAT fitted

Stock exhaust ( I feel this will flows enough air)

UPREV reflash.

 

The above set up I feel with give the most gain ( this will become a package deal from me)

 

The XYZ Y-pipe looks interesting. If you get the one with the CAT fitted does that mean you can do away with the other two cats before the Y-pipe and still pass an MOT? I'm surprised that you don't see plenum mods as the first port of call too as most people seem to see that as the most cost effective way to go initially.

 

Then I would fit headers and possibly a system ( weather your stock system falls aparts or you just want something a little more noisy) and a 5/16 spacer and Ignen filter kit and a map tweak , this I feel will give over 300bhp @ the flywheel with a big gain in mid-range torque.Might be worth try a Mrev on the above kit to see if it is worth trying.

 

I looked into headers recently and I was under the impression that headers either lost power or made no discernable improvement. Not many folks have gone this route though due to the horrendous labour charges. I did find some people saying the Crawford headers were an improvement but I don't know if anyone over here has tried them to see if they fit a UK car. I know the DC headers fit but they seem to be prone to cracking - not good considering what is involved in swapping them!

 

The sound is supposed to be though!

 

What have you found during your testing with headers?

 

Also might be worth trying a lower manifold spacer one of these;

 

http://www.motordyneengineering.com/ima ... cer180.jpg

 

We find lenghtening the intake length will increase torque.

 

 

I take it this would have to be an either/or mod with a plenum spacer due to clearance with the strut bar/bonnet (assuming it lifts the plenum)? It would be good to see which helps the most. I suspect the plenum spacer since Motordyne seem to be selling the manifold spacer as merely a way to add clearance for larger injectors. If it added significant performance I'd expect them to be hyping it more. That said, they obviously couldn't sell it for as much as a plenum spacer so that could be a factor!

 

Then I feel we really need to get into the motor to get anymore gains if we want to stay N/A or bolt a S/C kit on fit larger injectors/fuel pump and we should see 400bhp flywheel pretty easily.

 

Mark

 

I wish! I'd love to go the SC route but it would involve becoming single again!

[andlid]

 

Also might be worth trying a lower manifold spacer one of these;

 

http://www.motordyneengineering.com/ima ... cer180.jpg

 

We find lenghtening the intake length will increase torque.

 

Then I feel we really need to get into the motor to get anymore gains if we want to stay N/A or bolt a S/C kit on fit larger injectors/fuel pump and we should see 400bhp flywheel pretty easily.

 

Mark

So you put a spacer in between the lower plenum and the upper? (In my case that wouldn't be the case) I'd be interested in testing that, do you know of anyone distributing these in Europe? Would be easy for me to install too, wonder if it would clear the standard sway bar?

 

While I'm at it, anyone made their own intake system for the Z? ( If feel know that it's the most important upgrade for my current NA)

 

A

[Mark@Abbey m/s]

Motordyne make these , we will carry stock if they work.

 

 

Mark

[MattG]

So you put a spacer in between the lower plenum and the upper? (In my case that wouldn't be the case) I'd be interested in testing that, do you know of anyone distributing these in Europe? Would be easy for me to install too, wonder if it would clear the standard sway bar?

 

While I'm at it, anyone made their own intake system for the Z? ( If feel know that it's the most important upgrade for my current NA)

 

A

 

I've not had mine apart yet so I'm not sure, but my understanding is that it goes under the lower plenum and will therefore lift the whole lot by that amount.

[andlid]

So you put a spacer in between the lower plenum and the upper? (In my case that wouldn't be the case) I'd be interested in testing that, do you know of anyone distributing these in Europe? Would be easy for me to install too, wonder if it would clear the standard sway bar?

 

While I'm at it, anyone made their own intake system for the Z? ( If feel know that it's the most important upgrade for my current NA)

 

A

 

I've not had mine apart yet so I'm not sure, but my understanding is that it goes under the lower plenum and will therefore lift the whole lot by that amount.

I would think it wont clear the standard strut, would need to find out before getting one I'd say.

A.

[MattG]

I would think it wont clear the standard strut, would need to find out before getting one I'd say.

A.

 

Yeah definitely.

 

Whilst I have your attention, I see you have a Kintetix SSV. What do you think to it? Did it give any gains as they seem a bit controversial on the US forums. Also what's the sound from it like? They look ace!

 

It looks like it's now been superceded by the new velocity manifold though:

 

http://www.kinetixracing.com/new-ssvext ... 03-06.aspx

[andlid]

I would think it wont clear the standard strut, would need to find out before getting one I'd say.

A.

 

Yeah definitely.

 

Whilst I have your attention, I see you have a Kintetix SSV. What do you think to it? Did it give any gains as they seem a bit controversial on the US forums. Also what's the sound from it like? They look ace!

 

It looks like it's now been superceded by the new velocity manifold though:

 

http://www.kinetixracing.com/new-ssvext ... 03-06.aspx

Thats the one I got not sure, think for N/A it might have been a bit overkill. I do need to get the air flow going into the SSV sorted (cold air intake or something like AEM) before I know for sure but I think more bang for buck is a spacer (had one earlier in the car) if you're not planning on going FI, I do think some people prefer cosworth though (even though there was some old problems with the design it seems to not break during FI), the kinetix manifold looks the job though and obviously the sound is deadly My tuner did wonder where all the torq went when he did my map so I'm not sure if it's the intake side or the outake side that I've got some restriction. Guess is that it's my headers and possibly the design of the manifold is arseways (hope latter is not correct) I'm pretty interested in trying new headers, new intake system and the spacer mentioned above. Then I'd have a pretty much free flow the whole route through the engine and would probably need to look at changing internals and such to get any more gains. Not sure what to do with the car now actually since this year and end last year sucked work wise.

 

[MattG]

Thats the one I got not sure, think for N/A it might have been a bit overkill. I do need to get the air flow going into the SSV sorted (cold air intake or something like AEM) before I know for sure but I think more bang for buck is a spacer (had one earlier in the car) if you're not planning on going FI, I do think some people prefer cosworth though (even though there was some old problems with the design it seems to not break during FI), the kinetix manifold looks the job though and obviously the sound is deadly My tuner did wonder where all the torq went when he did my map so I'm not sure if it's the intake side or the outake side that I've got some restriction. Guess is that it's my headers and possibly the design of the manifold is arseways (hope latter is not correct) I'm pretty interested in trying new headers, new intake system and the spacer mentioned above. Then I'd have a pretty much free flow the whole route through the engine and would probably need to look at changing internals and such to get any more gains. Not sure what to do with the car now actually since this year and end last year sucked work wise.

 

 

Ah so you've got the new Velocity Manifold rather than the SSV? Thanks for the feedback, I might try the Motordyne route then if you're not too impressed. Is the noise really mental? I wouldn't want to make my car crazily noisy as it's a daily driver.

 

The fact that the "Stock 350z with no modifications" on the Kinetix Dyno graph revs to 7000rpm makes me a bit sceptical. Mine only revs to 6600rpm!

 

Although here's an independent test of the new Velocity Manifold:

 

http://my350z.com/forum/7825924-post11.html

 

The base dyno already had a spacer fitted too, so that seems like some good gains!

[rtbiscuit]

i remember reading about the ssv plenum, and it being slated for loosing power, and that its only really good if your going FI. it was a while ago, they may have changed it since then, but it seems over kill for an N/A car, BHP per £ spent isn't as cost effective as other methods of extracting N/A power

[Mark@Abbey m/s]

Kinetix SS plenum doesn't work full stop on a N/A car I gain over 10 lb/ft of torque when refitting a stock plenum without a spacer.

 

I will try the spacer below the lower collector as soon as 1 turn,s up.

 

I read the posts tommorrow and answer , good thread boys and girl.

[MattG]

Kinetix SS plenum doesn't work full stop on a N/A car I gain over 10 lb/ft of torque when refitting a stock plenum without a spacer.

 

I will try the spacer below the lower collector as soon as 1 turn,s up.

 

I read the posts tommorrow and answer , good thread boys and girl.

 

Cheers for the info, one to avoid then! Have you done any N/A testing with the Cosworth plenum on a non-revup car?

[Mark@Abbey m/s]

Have you done any N/A testing with the Cosworth plenum on a non-revup car?

 

These are only good again F/I just like the Kinetx manifold.

 

I can't see how anyone can design something that works as good as the stock designed plenum that Nissan must have spent a few quid developing. The spacer/Mrev will help a little because I feel Nissan had to lose a little height from the motor to make it fit under the bonnet/

[andlid]

Have you done any N/A testing with the Cosworth plenum on a non-revup car?

 

These are only good again F/I just like the Kinetx manifold.

 

I can't see how anyone can design something that works as good as the stock designed plenum that Nissan must have spent a few quid developing. The spacer/Mrev will help a little because I feel Nissan had to lose a little height from the motor to make it fit under the bonnet/

Pretty bad how both of them tell people of N/A gains...

 

when going FI, if that now will ever happen.

[MattG]

Pretty bad how both of them tell people of N/A gains...

 

when going FI, if that now will ever happen.

 

Yeah, I'd expect more from Cosworth especially. They even went as far as saying the plenum is not intended for FI once people started having problems with leaking end caps. Given it does bugger all N/A what is it intended for?!

[andlid]

Pretty bad how both of them tell people of N/A gains...

 

when going FI, if that now will ever happen.

 

Yeah, I'd expect more from Cosworth especially. They even went as far as saying the plenum is not intended for FI once people started having problems with leaking end caps. Given it does bugger all N/A what is it intended for?!

looks good though Think they've sorted the FI problems they had with leaks though... would be hard to 'see' that if you try and get one so you'd have to take the sellers word for it being a later model (thats fixed) think my updated model of the plenum is one that's not supossed to crack under lots of FI pressure (time will tell)

 

a.

[andlid]

jc0r 318 stock

 

 

[jc0r]

Yeah i thought it was a little down on power to be honest thats why i took it in. The HR engine should be 309 thereabout but i assumed it may have lost a little. Pleasantly suprised with the results though

[IanS16]

Yeah thats an awesome result

[rich5259]

Great result, same shape to the curves as on mine, tested at same dyno but when it was a lot hotter. I wonder how much difference the lower ambient temperature made.

[dcash5]

Took my car in for remapping at RS tuning - Leeds, Paul said to me its the best result he's had so far.

Well pleased with the results, a gain of 25 hp (304.2hp), higher rev to 7250 rpm, more mid torque, 100% throttle

response in every gear, 155mph cap removed. The car has turned into a rocket. Well done Paul & staff

at RS Tuning

 

http://img534.yfrog.com/i/dynochart.jpg/

 

don't know how to upload dyno chart, hope some does.

 

350z 06 revup facelift. standard runs on v power.

 

erm not being daft but isnt the rev-up 296bhp standard?