ZMANALEX Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 As for guarantees for the work then I will not be paying anything for an ECU if it proves not to be the problem. The old one will be swiftly put back in. This will definately be explained to the dealer. I hope that you are not missing the point here as this is not a guarantee issue. As Colin has previously stated unless you are standing over the Technicians and watching them very carefully as they replace the ecu then you are not to know if it is faulty or not. And yes it does happen.......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris`I Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 I would either get it in writing that they are going to only replace the ECU and if this doesnt resolve the problem that they will refit the old on at the cost of only labour, or put it in writing yourself that you only authorise to pay the to fit the ECU ONLY and see if that solves the problem. Do not authorise them to do anything else, and if they do so it is at their cost and not yours. That should stop them buggering around with the usual "process of elimination" as mentioned above is the current way of doing things these days with so called "mechanics". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nixy Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 in my experience some dealers with certainly try the 'quick fix' and if it doesn't work, hey ho, and onto the next thing while you pay for the experimenting. I had this experience before with peugeot which I knew was not going to be resolved by what they were suggesting because of what I had learned from a forum just like this. Be very careful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trev-the-Rev Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 Another issue you need to be aware of that I had to stomach with a Peugeot is there is sometimes a condition applied with electronic components that once fitted, they cannot be returned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZMANALEX Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 Another issue you need to be aware of that I had to stomach with a Peugeot is there is sometimes a condition applied with electronic components that once fitted, they cannot be returned. Spot on Trev. Once the new ecu is on it is on for good. Buyer beware, be very aware. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nixy Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 does anyone else think that mechanics rely too much on what a diagnostic machine says nowadays as well? Not that I know anything about it at all but it seems to me they rely far to much on what a machine tells them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GIXXERUK Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 Another issue you need to be aware of that I had to stomach with a Peugeot is there is sometimes a condition applied with electronic components that once fitted, they cannot be returned. spot on trev, a friend of mine was advised he needed a new ecu on his clio, £1200 later they told him it didnt work and he needed a new loom its too easy to point the finger at the biggest component Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ebized Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 does anyone else think that mechanics rely too much on what a diagnostic machine says nowadays as well? Not that I know anything about it at all but it seems to me they rely far to much on what a machine tells them. Its the way of th world Nixy. With exotic cars like Maclaren, diganostics and adjsutments are done from the other side of the world - years ago I could pull engines apart and reassemble without too much drama - I wouldn't even dream of doing that now without a decent laptop and the right software - no, correction - I wouldn't know how Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nixy Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 no I know what you mean, it's just a computer with wheels but plugging it in and getting a message isn't always correct is it? Like maybe in this case? God knows, you can't even see what's under the bonnet these days! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtbiscuit Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 no I know what you mean, it's just a computer with wheels but plugging it in and getting a message isn't always correct is it? Like maybe in this case? God knows, you can't even see what's under the bonnet these days! remember how many times your desktop screws up and gives you retarded messages, when actually its something else, or doesn't even tell you what the problem is, just that its not happy and refuses to do what you tell it to the car ECU is not really any different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teddyonholiday Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 first of all guys the ecu should be isolated. Disconnect the battery for at least 30 mins. Then when the power is restored the ecu should default to factory settings. Only then will the true nature of the fault be seen. Then get the codes read by consult II by a dealer. With that info we can make a far better judgement, the generic code readers can't interprt manufacturers codes properly and this can often leadto bad diagnosis. Get the codes cleared don't attempt to start the vehicle then do the battery bit and then try the start, then if you post up the codes we might be able to help. Best of luck Ted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GIXXERUK Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 Hi Ted, i think he has tried that and he got :- DTC P0605 ECM Component Description The ECM consists of a microcomputer and connectors for signal input and output and for power supply. The ECM controls the engine. On Board Diagnosis Logic This self-diagnosis has one or two trip detection logic. FAIL-SAFE MODE ECM enters fail-safe mode when the malfunction A is detected. DTC Confirmation Procedure Perform PROCEDURE FOR MALFUNCTION A first. If the 1st trip DTC cannot be confirmed, perform PROCEDURE FOR MALFUNCTION B. If there is no malfunction on PROCEDURE FOR MALFUNCTION B, perform PROCEDURE FOR MALFUNCTION C. NOTE: If DTC Confirmation Procedure has been previously conducted, always turn ignition switch OFF and wait at least 10 seconds before conducting the next test. PROCEDURE FOR MALFUNCTION A With CONSULT-II 1. Turn ignition switch ON. 2. Select “DATA MONITOR†Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teddyonholiday Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 The reason for asking for the ecu to be restarted would be to isolate any 1st or 2nd trip codes, these may mask the "pre start" errors that would confirm the type C malfunction . I would want to try all possible faults befor replacing the ecu and a used one would need to checked for NATS compatabilty as it forms part of the immobilser system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GIXXERUK Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 i would need more convincing that a fault isnt isnt being masked and only appears to be an ecu fault before i parted with any cash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teddyonholiday Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 I would hope to find out the progression of the fault using this and therefore eliminate any sensor faults first. I personally think it may be the ecu is locking but the fault may not be the ecu itself. I am quite often in Manchester city centre and would offer to have a look but it is unlikely that I will be up there until mid January as I am on three weeks hols at the moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GIXXERUK Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 I would hope to find out the progression of the fault using this and therefore eliminate any sensor faults first. I personally think it may be the ecu is locking but the fault may not be the ecu itself. I am quite often in Manchester city centre and would offer to have a look but it is unlikely that I will be up there until mid January as I am on three weeks hols at the moment. so your username says Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarnie Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 I would hope to find out the progression of the fault using this and therefore eliminate any sensor faults first. I personally think it may be the ecu is locking but the fault may not be the ecu itself. I am quite often in Manchester city centre and would offer to have a look but it is unlikely that I will be up there until mid January as I am on three weeks hols at the moment. Bloody hell, blast from the past!! Aren't they bluelady's legs in the avatar? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seasider Posted December 17, 2008 Author Share Posted December 17, 2008 When trying to resolve the problem yesterday we had the battery off for about 2 hours as initially I was confirming whether it was a flat battery. Then after reconnection we got the 0605 error code. The AA guy also got this after lots of experimenting (I was actually quite impressed with the AA guy which was surprising as for once he knew what he was doing) as did the Nissan garage. I am not sure if they tried the procedure below so will ask this. Thanks for all the advice though guys it has been really useful. I will be speaking with the garage later after they have discussed directly with Nissan. I will get the assurances but I cannot see another next step than a new ECU going in with an agreement that I am not paying for it if it does not fix it. If it does fix it then I am going to get heavily onto Nissan for some money back from them. All in all has put me off Nissan's for life which is a shame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toon Chris Posted December 17, 2008 Share Posted December 17, 2008 All in all has put me off Nissan's for life which is a shame. I wouldn't let thsi affect your opinions if Nissans. Generally they are very good and thsi sort of problem could happen with any car - and usually does, much more frequently! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seasider Posted December 18, 2008 Author Share Posted December 18, 2008 The plot thickens with this. Nissan have come back and said they will not pay anything towards the ECU as they have never had an ECU fail on a 350z and think it has been caused most probably by trying to jump start and there being a spark causing the unit to short out. The car was tried to be jump started a few times by myself and the recovery guy. I don't recall any sparks and it does seem over sensitive that this would cause the issue but c'est la vie. Therefore what is likely is that the ECU has failed on top of their being a lower level fault that we cannot find because of the failed ECU. Great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZMANALEX Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 The plot thickens with this. Nissan have come back and said they will not pay anything towards the ECU as they have never had an ECU fail on a 350z and think it has been caused most probably by trying to jump start and there being a spark causing the unit to short out. The car was tried to be jump started a few times by myself and the recovery guy. I don't recall any sparks and it does seem over sensitive that this would cause the issue but c'est la vie. Therefore what is likely is that the ECU has failed on top of their being a lower level fault that we cannot find because of the failed ECU. Great. I can not say anymore than what I and others have said in previous posts except.............. Get A Profesional 2nd Diagnoses................ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nixy Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 i agree. I would have thought there must be some kind of independent Nissan/Big Phil type/Jap car/ specialist somewhere you can turn to? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcash5 Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 Just a thought have you checked the fusable links on the Positive battery clamps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seasider Posted December 18, 2008 Author Share Posted December 18, 2008 ZMANALEX it is not a case of a second diagnosis anymore. I have been and seen the errors myself. The unit is definately dead. They have run all the diagnostics people have listed on here and more and they all indicate a dead ECU. It has been confirmed by Nissan central based on the information provided. Unless someone knows more than Nissan do about the 350z ECU. The only outstanding question is whether the ECU was dead before I came to start the car on Monday or the problem was something else and along the way the ECU was killed. The only way left to deduce this will be if when the new ECU is fitted if the car then works it indicates the ECU was dead before I came to start it and I have then have grounds with Nissan. If when the ECU is fitted it higlights another problem then the ECU has been killed through me/recovery guy trying to get the car started. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZMANALEX Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 ZMANALEX it is not a case of a second diagnosis anymore. I have been and seen the errors myself. The unit is definately dead. They have run all the diagnostics people have listed on here and more and they all indicate a dead ECU. It has been confirmed by Nissan central based on the information provided. Unless someone knows more than Nissan do about the 350z ECU. The only outstanding question is whether the ECU was dead before I came to start the car on Monday or the problem was something else and along the way the ECU was killed. The only way left to deduce this will be if when the new ECU is fitted if the car then works it indicates the ECU was dead before I came to start it and I have then have grounds with Nissan. If when the ECU is fitted it higlights another problem then the ECU has been killed through me/recovery guy trying to get the car started. This will be my last post on this thread. The advice that you are getting from this forum is all based upon members genuinely trying to help you solve your problem and save you big money, comments and advice should be accepted in the same spirit in which they are given and all the advice that I have personally provided is based upon personal 1st hand experience. Perhaps at the end of the day your ECU is dead and perhaps you will never know why and perhaps it may fail again in 6 months time due to an underlying issue or perhaps the new ECU will not fix the problem and it may be traced to a two penny fuse, and perhaps you may end up paying huge sums of money for parts that were not required and perhaps you will never know any different. I have just checked with Nissan U.K through a contact and I have been reliably informed that Nissan U.K have never sold a new ECU or supplied one under warranty in the past 3 years. Surely that tells you something. My cynicism is based upon lifes experiences. However, I wish you good luck and that you are reunited with your Zed in the not to distant future. Alex. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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