Flashback Posted October 13, 2019 Share Posted October 13, 2019 2 minutes ago, Flashback said: Toyota launched its first production fuel cell vehicle (FCV), the Mirai, in Japan at the end of 2014 and began sales in California, mainly the Los Angeles area, in 2015.[15] The car has a range of 312 mi (502 km) and takes about five minutes to refill its hydrogen tank. Hyundai Nexo - rated at 500 mile using NEDC, projected real world at 370 miles range. Launched 2018. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilogikal1 Posted October 13, 2019 Share Posted October 13, 2019 48 minutes ago, gangzoom said: You haven't looked up how hydrogen fuel stations actually deliver their fuel have you? If you think you can just rock to a hydrogen fuel station and add 400 miles of range in sub 5 minutes you literally have no idea what your going on about, for a start there aren't even a 400 mile range hydrogen fuel cell car for sale anywhere in the world. No, you’re right. I was referring to petrol/diesel cars, not hydrogen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilogikal1 Posted October 13, 2019 Share Posted October 13, 2019 But I have now. Around 5 minutes to refuel with real life range of 405 miles. My word, how wrong I got that!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldel Posted October 13, 2019 Share Posted October 13, 2019 11 hours ago, gangzoom said: If you want/like fast cars, EVs are simply the next step. Therein is the problem. Clearly for you 'fast cars' is pointing it in a straight line and planting your foot. For me its more directed at lightweight, low slung, racing position driving and of course with the lovely noise that comes with it. Hence why I couldn't resist going back to a VX. I agree with you, if you are into straight line power then a weighty overpowered EV is the way to go - if driving for someone is about something else, then EVs really are not a simple next step they are anti what a lot of people love about performance cars. I am sure once EVs come down to practical prices in 5-10 years for used ones then I will probably get one for the school run and shopping etc. but for me personally, performance cars are not just about how fast you can drive it down an airstrip - and before you mention it, I have driven a model s and was not impressed by its handling at all, in fact I would say my old Celica GT4 was better with its 25 year old tech. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wozzy Posted October 13, 2019 Share Posted October 13, 2019 On 09/10/2019 at 22:51, HEADPHONES said: There you go Part2 Myself and a guy at work are following this, shame it's like 5x the price of the car to do but when the motors come down in price I'm 100% game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GranTurismoEra Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 people would rather buy that smoking banger and make money somehow as most of them are living on less than a pound a day in many countries. Sounds like a 10 percent market for those who can afford it. Obviously over time they will become more accessible to the rest of the population. By then there will be different laws on where you can go with them and taxes applied. It will be easier to take public transport or hail an autonomus 4 seater pod anyway Also the rear mounted motors where fitted to a 2019 Civic in US also. Powering the rear wheels. Worked really well. Hydrogen is still in the process. A few manufacturers are already working on this like BMW, Toyota, Mercedes but its still a costly process and a lack of infrastructure. BMW want to get a concept car X5 to production one day..Apparently they did this in 2005 with the 7 series??!! Just showing the possibilities Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangzoom Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 22 hours ago, coldel said: I agree with you, if you are into straight line power then a weighty overpowered EV is the way to go - if driving for someone is about something else, then EVs really are not a simple next step they are anti what a lot of people love about performance cars. Hence the VX was a run away sales success and Lotus cannot keep up with demand? The current crop of mass market EVs are designed to be just that, cars most people buy. The performance is almost by accident. You don't want your daily driver to be fast and cheap to run?? If you want a car to tinker with than EV drivetrains really are hard to ignore, bare in mind we are only at the start of proper EV development. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldel Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 (edited) On 14/10/2019 at 18:46, gangzoom said: Hence the VX was a run away sales success and Lotus cannot keep up with demand? The current crop of mass market EVs are designed to be just that, cars most people buy. The performance is almost by accident. You don't want your daily driver to be fast and cheap to run?? Actually no, I do not care one jot about how fast my daily driver is. I am either pootling around town or driving my young son/wife around. We have a 1.6L Qashqai and I use probably 50% of the available power on average, in fact that's probably an overstatement, so whats the benefit of more? None whatsoever. The running cost would be a great bonus I agree with you there (setting aside the elephant in the room we don't have a drive so cannot charge the car at home), but I am not going to throw tens of thousands of pounds at an EV when we bought a cheap runaround Qashqai for a few grand, I will never see the return of the EV investment given the entry point of say a Model 3 let alone further up the price ladder. And as I say, i don't really care that much for a daily driver that I would throw that much money at it. Sure EVs have evolved into brutally fast straight line cars, but they are heavy, they handle comparatively like boats unless track tuned. Which is why I love great handling cars like the VX, you climb into what is essentially a racing seat/position, you can use that benefit legally on the road, the car looks and sounds stunning - not to mention faster in a straight line than 99% of other cars on the road. Would I swap it for a silent heavy box, not for what I enjoy driving for. Back on point, as I said previously once EVs get way down into a price range that is worth the outlay and the infrastructure is in place, will happily get a daily one to pootle about in. I am not anti-EV in the way you are anti-ICE I welcome them coming along. Edited October 16, 2019 by coldel 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilogikal1 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 On 14/10/2019 at 19:46, gangzoom said: Hence the VX was a run away sales success and Lotus cannot keep up with demand? Exactly. In very much the same way that they Taycan is such a storming success that Tesla can’t keep up with demand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeybrain1234 Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 Electric car discussions are about as interesting as Brexit talks 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GranTurismoEra Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 Its not meant to be interesting or exciting. Nothing about EVs are unless youre a tech savvy individual or mad scientist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben–350Z Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 Do green number plates tempt you? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-50122268 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATTAK Z Posted October 22, 2019 Author Share Posted October 22, 2019 16 minutes ago, Ben–350Z said: Do green number plates tempt you? ERGGHH !!! @Keyser might like though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATTAK Z Posted October 22, 2019 Author Share Posted October 22, 2019 The new Tesla Roadster looks interesting ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldel Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 I was going to say the green number plates go hand in hand with the 'urgh' blandness of the current ideas around EV styling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Umster Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 Green number plates might work in a more tolerant place but I see it causing more trouble than it's worth. Prioritising electric cars at any point during this government is gonna cause so much kickback after the whole diesel emissions scandal, (previous) government promoting diesels etc etc Now to give electric cars a free pass in bus lanes, reduced parking prices etc. That's brave. Crux is, electric ain't sexy yet because its so frustrating to live with. One chap at my place loses his sh17 when someone hogs his space cause it means he won't be able to drive home in his leaf haha! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldel Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 5 minutes ago, Umster said: Green number plates might work in a more tolerant place but I see it causing more trouble than it's worth. Prioritising electric cars at any point during this government is gonna cause so much kickback after the whole diesel emissions scandal, (previous) government promoting diesels etc etc Now to give electric cars a free pass in bus lanes, reduced parking prices etc. That's brave. Crux is, electric ain't sexy yet because its so frustrating to live with. One chap at my place loses his sh17 when someone hogs his space cause it means he won't be able to drive home in his leaf haha! What I would like to see is some sort of high output battery pack, you can charge in the house, go outside and connect to your car parked up the road and it dumps the charge into the car in like 5 minutes giving it say 15% range or something. Game changer in terms of making it much more practical for those houses that don't have driveways (which in busy cities is the majority by some distance). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Umster Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 1 minute ago, coldel said: What I would like to see is some sort of high output battery pack, you can charge in the house, go outside and connect to your car parked up the road and it dumps the charge into the car in like 5 minutes giving it say 15% range or something. Game changer in terms of making it much more practical for those houses that don't have driveways (which in busy cities is the majority by some distance). This would work but holistically speaking, the energy needs to come from a "green" source and if coming from the grid will need to be "smoothed" out. After learning about how the National Grid needs to manage energy, like when people get up for a cup of tea during adverts of popular TV shows or sports events, it makes me think this whole problem needs describing from start to finish before we make any quick wins. Some quick wins might end up hurting us more in the long run. Either way, I agree with the idea and I hope something sustainable comes up soon. At some point I'm gonna have to go electric and I don't want these issues to deal with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stoofer Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 This, the "living in flats/rented house issue", is why I think EVs are not going to properly take off until they will drive off fully automated and go charge themselves, returning for when they're needed. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilogikal1 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 Or, you know... charging wherever you actually park becomes an option. Just as an alternative to cars driving themselves around looking for electricity. On a different note, I almost admire the complete ignorance of the cradle-to-grave impact of electric cars on the environment and the sheer nonsensical hyperbole of “green, innit”. Almost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldel Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 Dig the roads up and put wireless charging under all parking areas. Park up, system knows your car, it charges where its parked, system bills you directly. Job done! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formatzero Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7592485/Father-eight-invents-electric-car-battery-drivers-1-500-miles-without-charging-it.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stoofer Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 Digging up all the roads without double yellows for wireless charging really isn't going to happen. A government project of that scale is always going to be a disaster. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Umster Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 Urban planning has never had to think about the issue with charging cars. Heck, most houses built before the 90s didn't even consider that there would be more than 1 car per household. Feel like charging points are going to be the new OpenReach/Fibre Optic. Nobody wants to dig up the roads, nobody wants to foot the bill and nobody is gonna get it right the first time around. It's either got to be rapid charging or being able to swap batteries in a car. No current practical solution that could scale comes to mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GranTurismoEra Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 5 hours ago, Ben–350Z said: Do green number plates tempt you? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-50122268 saw that......Nope! What an iSaw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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