Write off or Not?

[Dicky]

Does anyone have any good rule of thumb as to what difference 1000 miles would make to a cars value.

Also has anyone taken an insurance company to court over such a matter.

[Dicky]

3 hours ago, Sargara said:

There is a couple of 2010 models around 50k mileage on Autotrader from traders at around that figure so it seems fair to me.

The only low milage Black editions I can see are on offer for £15k & £16k?

 

Just read Admirals definition of terms and Market Value is defined as “The cost of replacing your car , with one of similar make, model, year, milage and condition based on market prices at the time of the loss”

 

Google defines market value as “The highest estimated price that a buyer would pay and a seller would accept”.

 

I would interperate this as...if someone asks £16000 for his car and I turn up and offer an acceptable price of £15500 then that’s the market value??

 

What do you think?

 

[Kryptek49]

55 minutes ago, Dicky said:

Does anyone have any good rule of thumb as to what difference 1000 miles would make to a cars value.

Also has anyone taken an insurance company to court over such a matter.

I'm sure you will be able to come to an agreement with your insurer before you feel it's necessary to take them to court.

Are they aware that your car is a special edition? You would expect to replace your car like for like so therefore would expect to be able to re-purchase the trim level you previously had.

 

There are black editions on AutoTrader with 45k miles for £15.5k, so realistically your car would be worth £14.5 - 15k due to the higher mileage.

 

Tell that to your insurer, but don't start threatening court cases unless you mean it as they may stop negotiating then and there.

[Umster]

59 minutes ago, Dicky said:

Does anyone have any good rule of thumb as to what difference 1000 miles would make to a cars value.

Also has anyone taken an insurance company to court over such a matter.

Don't cut your nose off. Just look online and show the insurer how much your car would be to buy in the current market. 

 

You're never going to get every penny back on the car, it's the way the world works. I'm also with Admiral and I know they won't pay out the full amount on additional extras, but that's what you get for buying the cheapest policy on the market. 

[nissanman312]

Be patient send lots of examples and hold out for a little more I'd say based on what you say it's avaible on line

 

I havnt personally looked at prices of the 370 since I bought my latest one nearly 3 years ago so only going on what you say above 

 

I got 17k for my 2010 gt with around 40k miles 3 year ago

They offerd me 12k for it initially 

[Sargara]

2 hours ago, Dicky said:

The only low milage Black editions I can see are on offer for £15k & £16k?

 

Just read Admirals definition of terms and Market Value is defined as “The cost of replacing your car , with one of similar make, model, year, milage and condition based on market prices at the time of the loss”

 

Google defines market value as “The highest estimated price that a buyer would pay and a seller would accept”.

 

I would interperate this as...if someone asks £16000 for his car and I turn up and offer an acceptable price of £15500 then that’s the market value??

 

What do you think?

 

Sorry missed the Black Edition bit.

[Ekona]

You cannot take them to court. You can argue to the ombudsman, but at this point you’re not going to get significantly more. 

 

If there’s BE cars out there for £14.5k, then a realistic offer could be £13k. So at £11.5k isn’t actually that bad a place to be. 

 

 

Is it specifically insured as a BE? What extras did the BE come with anyway? It might actually not be worth any more than a regular 370. 

[nissanman312]

12 minutes ago, Ekona said:

You cannot take them to court. You can argue to the ombudsman, but at this point you’re not going to get significantly more. 

 

If there’s BE cars out there for £14.5k, then a realistic offer could be £13k. So at £11.5k isn’t actually that bad a place to be. 

 

 

Is it specifically insured as a BE? What extras did the BE come with anyway? It might actually not be worth any more than a regular 370. 

Black wheels 

Red brakes 

Red seats 

That's about it 

 

 

[rabbitstew]

From my previous look at values, it sounds like they have basically offered you the trade value - i.e. the price a garage would buy it for, rather than the price you would have to pay for it. As others have said, tell them its a black edition and give them the examples of the 2 current ones for sale at £15k and £16k - which whilst they have slightly lower mileage is a good starting point. Id expect yours to be priced at £14k at a garage to reflect the slightly higher miles.

[Ekona]

Out of curiosity, what would WBAC pay for it?

[rabbitstew]

12 minutes ago, Ekona said:

Out of curiosity, what would WBAC pay for it?

Was £10,500 when I checked the other day, so basically the "trade" or "auction" price which is roughly 25% lower than retail.

[Dicky]

10 hours ago, rabbitstew said:

From my previous look at values, it sounds like they have basically offered you the trade value - i.e. the price a garage would buy it for, rather than the price you would have to pay for it. As others have said, tell them its a black edition and give them the examples of the 2 current ones for sale at £15k and £16k - which whilst they have slightly lower mileage is a good starting point. Id expect yours to be priced at £14k at a garage to reflect the slightly higher miles.

Well I’ve already done those things. They’re aware it’s a low milage Black Edition and I’ve quoted the sale price of those on Auto Trader. Your right in your assumption that they are offering trade/part ex prices and not market value as their Insurance document states they would do.

Im not threatening court action as yet simply that I want to esculate matters to an independent arbitrator. They suggested the Motoring Ombudsman but their customers reviews are appalling in fact Trust Pilot reviewers rate them 2% good, 98 % useless, so I won’t be using them!

A Nissan dealership I have my 350 serviced at, using a Glasses guide, suggested they would put it on their forcourt at £13750 while trade in prices would be £10.2k-£11k

[Ekona]

Again, you cannot take court action, you can only go via the Financial Ombudsman if you feel their offer is not good enough. Look at their website for more details: https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/publications/technical_notes/motor-insurance.html

 

However, the pertinent bit is this:

In general, we don’t think adverts are necessarily a reliable guide to a vehicle’s price. That’s because vehicles can be advertised at a higher price than they eventually sell for - and small differences in condition can have a big impact on the value. So it’s unlikely we’ll place much weight on adverts when we’re deciding whether an insurer’s valuation is reasonable. But we may do if the adverts strongly suggest the guides could be wrong or the car’s a classic or rare model.

To decide whether an insurer’s valuation is fair, we’ll check the selling price of similar vehicles in specialist on-line motor trade guides called Parkers (if the complaint is close to the date of the loss or damage), Glass’s, CAP and Cazana. These bring together thousands of auction prices (as a base to decide the likely selling price) and adverts of similar vehicles - taking into account variations like age, mileage, condition, and regional or seasonal differences.

If the amount the insurer paid is in line with the guides, it’s likely we’ll say the valuation is fair. But if we think the insurer hasn’t made a fair valuation, we’ll tell them to adjust it - using the guide prices.

If one of the guide prices is significantly higher or lower, we may think it’s reasonable to ignore it. What’s significant will depend on the price of the vehicle - for example, a difference of £200 would be significant for a £1,000 car, but not a £9,000 car.

It’s important to check that the vehicle’s details have been recorded correctly. We see complaints where insurers and their customers have made mistakes - meaning the prices they’re disputing are wrong in the first place.

[Ebized]

20 hours ago, Ekona said:

Out of curiosity, what would WBAC pay for it?

Why not try this as it was just before the accident?

 

Or see if your Nissan garage would be preparec to put the prices they mentioned in writing?

[Dicky]

On 08/02/2019 at 11:01, Ekona said:

Out of curiosity, what would WBAC pay for it?

Who?

[Dicky]

On 08/02/2019 at 21:31, Ekona said:

Again, you cannot take court action, you can only go via the Financial Ombudsman if you feel their offer is not good enough. Look at their website for more details: https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/publications/technical_notes/motor-insurance.html

 

However, the pertinent bit is this:

 

 

Very good info, thanks. It boils my blood that they quote offer figures from data the public aren’t privy to, so you can only used current sal/forcourt prices.

Admirals Policy docs state they will replace like for like (in so many words) they also quote “Market Value” will be offered. That’s defined as the price a buyer is prepared to pay and a seller is prepared to accept. If a car is offere for sale at £15000 I believe it’s reasonable to agree that a final agreed sale price might be £14000-£14500, so why they quote unrealistic prices from Glasses guide angers me!

[Ebized]

6 hours ago, Dicky said:

Who?

https://www.webuyanycar.com/

[rabbitstew]

13 hours ago, Ebized said:

https://www.webuyanycar.com/

I did this earlier in this thread and they quoted a rough price of £10,500 for the OP`s car, which matches the trade or auction price. i.e. 25% less than forecourt price.

 

All that blah about not being able to take advertised prices as sold prices is a load of bull really. Sure, sometimes there is some negotiation, especially with private sales, but for the last 3 or 4 cars ive bought from dealers, getting anything at all knocked off the screen price was pretty much impossible. Especially on cars like a 370z. When I bought my 350z I had to pay full screen price and after 4 hours of haggling I got 6 months tax and a tank of fuel. When I bought my 911 I didnt even get that, had to pay full screen price.

[Dicky]

Apologies it’s a long read

Well it’s all settled now!

Heres the way it goes with Admiral and I guess their associated companies, when your faced with a write off. 

1...someone calls and begins by offering Trade in values derived from Glasses guide. ADVICE...Counter this with lots of laughing and tell them you’ve been around the block a few times and fully undertand they’re working to their training script but lets get real here.

Quote their Policy document statement  on “Market Value”. In my case this lifted their offer from £10600 to £11500 during the call, Oh by the way, the increase was because he liked me but would normally have offered this to someone who had bought their car from a main dealer and not privately as in my case. They then terminate the call with...”this is our best offer and if not satisfied refer you to the Motoring Ombudsman”.

I sent an email to the claims department deriding their disingenuous offer and the biased Motoring industry funded Ombudsman who by the way rated a Trust Pilot customer review rate of 2% who found them to be good and 98% who found them to be crap!

2...next day a different person called and after repeating my disgust offered £12040, the highest Glasses guide valuation they could offer and if not satisfied referred me to their colleague the Ombudsman. I again refused their offer and use of the Ombudsman.

3...I called the dealership who serviced my 350 and daughters 370 to ask for help on the Glasses guide. They informed me that they would buy the 370 in for between £10000 & £11000 and would put it on the forcourt for £13750.

4... I called the claims dep again and spoke to yet another person, explaining my dealerships statement and the results of my own online valuations all of which indicted a higher price should be offered and I would settle for £13750, which was less then I would have to pay to replace the car (I would have settled for £13k as it happens).

This call turned out to be beneficial because after relaying the previous conversations she said they could carry out a 3 valuation report, something not mentioned by her other colleagues. This involved getting valuations from HPI, Glasses Guide and Parker’s, bear in mind that my own research and free valuations indicated that glasses and Parker’s were always the lowest and Parker’s quote theirs for a car with 90K miles so you have to pro-rata the milage, I used £60/1k miles.

5...They called back about two days later, this time it was the girl who offered her max price of £12040 (the max she could possible offer remember) She said I would be pleased to know that HPI came in with the highest valuation at £13200 and this was their 3rd final offer, or was it their 4th?

6 Having accepted this offer I sat back gave a big sigh but then recalled that my HPI valuation was £13450 no £13200.

7 next day called them again, got a different person again, relayed the progress to date and my disgust at being fiddled out of £250 and demanded to know why. He was unable to explain and said he would have his manager call me back in the next 24hrs. I backed this conversation up with an email (as I did for all telephone conversations). 

8 Next day I called HPI myself. They couldn’t understand why the difference so ran another valuation which came in at £13595 and suggested this is what I should have been offered.

9 Admirals claims dept manager didn’t call so I called him, explained the history and wanted an answer. After lots of computer clicking and Oh I’m so sorry the computers slow today etc etc I finally got an unexpected answer. Apparently they pay out the valuation received on the day of the accident, when I ran my valuation sometime later it had increased by £250 and when HPI ran theirs again a while later it had increased again. Didnt know valuations went up/down over such short time scales!

Anyway I accepted his explanation and settled.

10 THE MORAL OF THE STORY.....Dig you heels in, do your own research, assume their objective is to pay out as little as they can get away with, and for me pay a bit more for the Premium and go with a better company like NFU or Saga.

 

 

 

[rabbitstew]

Glad you got it all sorted out in the end.  I was with Admiral for 6 years before moving elsewhere, and based on your experience it kind of puts me off ever going back with them!

 

[Ponsonby]

1 hour ago, Dicky said:

A assume their objective is to pay out as little as they can get away with, and for me pay a bit more for the Premium and go with a better company like NFU or Saga.

 

 

 

I think that most, if not all, insurance companies will pay out as little as they can get away with. Like everything else these days you have to put up a fight to get the best price.

My father was insured with Saga. He stuck with them because they promised to look after old folk and give them the best deal. I was shocked when I found out how much he was paying, claims free for his entire driving life and on a 1.25 Fiesta.

Well done for digging your heels in and getting an acceptable solution.