Spatt Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 The M235i and M240i kind of jumped out at me recently.... i've always had an interest in BMW motors as my dads always had one though nothing majorly sporty they drive brilliantly. I have toyed with an E89 (Z4) for some time and after more consideration for space and seats i started looking else ware in search of a compromise.. which leads me onto the 1 series and 2 series or "M lights" as they are known. At some point i will have to change up the 350z for something more modern, more economical and something with more than two seats the running costs of the car are becoming more apparent and i don't get to use it as often as i'd like but in any case i want something more modern eventually... The 1 series never appealed to me as it looked more of a 'boys car' being a hatchback but it is very practical. The nicer lines on the 2 series are growing on me and i must say i wasn't convinced at first but the figures are stunning. 0 - 60 in a claimed 4.5 seconds (with the auto) coming from an inline 6 335bhp engine claimed MPG of 30 - 48 and a road tax of £190 per year looking at current values if they continue to drop a little more this could well be achievable and as a box ticker i dont think anything can hold a candle to it so what do you guys think? Are the "m lights" a winner, i know its all subjective but lets consider the pros and cons, its certainly good food for thought Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Ignore the figures, you'll never get anywhere near that mpg and 0-60 is a useless stat. What they are is utterly brilliant, and far far far better than an M4. Far better. One of the most fun cars I've ever driven in OEM road guise, they're a superb car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spatt Posted October 25, 2017 Author Share Posted October 25, 2017 56 minutes ago, Ekona said: Ignore the figures, you'll never get anywhere near that mpg and 0-60 is a useless stat. What they are is utterly brilliant, and far far far better than an M4. Far better. One of the most fun cars I've ever driven in OEM road guise, they're a superb car. see i thought an M4 or M3 would be more 'fun' but sensibly trying to run one of those cars would be too much for me. what car did you drive Dan? I've made my mind up about the 8speed auto, people cant get enough of it... is it as good as they say? 18 inch wheels can be wrapped in sporty rubber at a relatively low cost too compared to the 19 or 20 inch wheels on the "real" M cars, should even be cheaper than wrapping the zed with tyres as they aren't that wide. I haven't driven one, i haven't been in one so i guess thats the next step but i cant think of another car for 18 - 24k that ticks the boxes these things can Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 M3/4 is one of the most disappointing cars I've ever driven. I spent a day with an F80 M3 and then 20 mins with an M235i when I took the M3 back to the dealership and told them it was rubbish, so they gave me the smaller car to see if they could get a sale that way. It was the sport auto option too, so as close to comparable to the DCT M3 as you can get. I reckon the slushbox was nigh-on as good as the DCT, and certainly not noticeably worse at all. Chassis felt much more alive and the suspension didn't want to kill me every time I stepped on the gas which was a bonus. The 235 was proper chuckable, just a really fun car. In the end it wasn't for me as the inside was just too 118d to feel truly special, but now I've lived with an older BMW interior for a bit I reckon I'd have no issues with it. In terms of the drive though, I can remember those 20 minutes as well as I can any drive I ever took in the 350. I'd still get a manual over an auto though, unless you sit in traffic day in day out. BMW make some really decent manuals, get them while you can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spatt Posted October 25, 2017 Author Share Posted October 25, 2017 what does the comfort, sport and sport plus modes make in a manual car? I dont know, i drove a friends C63 and found the auto box to be a lot of fun (although it was a little slow for my liking) i'd like to use the car alot more maybe even if its not every day and sitting in traffic is guaranteed. I think i'll try the auto for sure and then after living with a both i could make my mind up about which i prefer. I know what you mean about the interior but i think if you get the pro nav, H&K speakers, sunroof and a lighter colour the general feel is more premium Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 It's more the general layout, none of that really changes at all so it does look like a 118d Not that a 118d is a bad car, but you know what I mean. Not sure on the various modes, I think you just get eco and sport which change the throttle mapping, neither here nor there really. I'd be very careful about over-speccing a 240, easy to get carried away and then you'll get slaughtered on resale as too many extras won't make any difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docwra Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Not sure I agree on the M3/M4 comparison, I know a lot of former M Lite owners that would say that too .......... the real M cars are a different prospect entirely. M Lites, from the old 135i M Sport (like Ive got) through M135i/M235i and onto the current M140/M240 dont really have any competition to speak of, if youre looking for a relatively small, practical RWD performance car then youre buying one They are immensely better with a few easy suspension mods (control arms and ARB's mainly) and the loss of runflats, with an LSD they are absolutely superb. They are incredibly good value for what they are IMO, but the real bargains are the F21 M135i's, the prices match their numberplate years and they are just superb all round cars. Having driven more than 7K miles in N55 cars the auto is probably the best box choice too, hes wrong on that as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spatt Posted October 25, 2017 Author Share Posted October 25, 2017 8 minutes ago, Ekona said: It's more the general layout, none of that really changes at all so it does look like a 118d Not that a 118d is a bad car, but you know what I mean. Not sure on the various modes, I think you just get eco and sport which change the throttle mapping, neither here nor there really. I'd be very careful about over-speccing a 240, easy to get carried away and then you'll get slaughtered on resale as too many extras won't make any difference. i wouldn't be speccing an M240i anyway (ive seen how crazy they can get on price) you can spec an M240i to nearly 50K if your not careful. My plan is to pick up second hand with a list of my preferred options in mind i couldn't afford the PCP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docwra Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 (edited) Oh, and if you fancy one on HP TRL do some incredible offers, I can send you a calculator but in the meantime ........ List price for standard car £36,415. OTRTRL offer price inc Q4 finance deposit contribution is £28,975 OTRCustomer Deposit £1,000 then 47 x £349 pm GFV £14,858.Based on 8000m PA and 3.9% APR. Edited October 25, 2017 by docwra 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spatt Posted October 25, 2017 Author Share Posted October 25, 2017 1 minute ago, docwra said: Oh, and if you fancy one on HP TRL do some incredible offers, I can send you a calculator I dont understand HP and PCP fully if i'm honest. A guy at nissan told me i could drive away a 370 nismo brand new for about £150 a month but i'd need to find like 18k at the end of three years.. I saved hard for my zed and i intend to do the same with a small loan for my next one unless my circumstances change Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 PCP works if you only intend to keep the car a few years and not keep it long term, else it's a killer. Well, unless the dealer gets their sums horribly wrong, which they tend not to do these days. Doc's offer he mentions is a bloody good one on face value. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 M2's are a bargain at the moment due to being replaced by the m2 cs (m3/4 engine) early next year. The m3/4 is a awesome car and the best value performance car by a mile. Nothing comes close for the money (mid to late 30's). The current m3/4 CP cars have solved the suspect suspension and damping, and early cars are easily sorted with KW's and a software update. M3 will be my next car for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Still can't make them not sound like a bag of nails though. I don't get the love for them, I really don't. Best value performance car is obviously a bit hard to define, but no way does an M4 even come close. At that price range 981 yes, M240i yes, hell even a current Mustang yes, but definitely not an F80/2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 (edited) I actually love the sound with a Akra or mpe. I know a lot don't. They remind me of old group b rally cars. The pops and bangs sound mental. I should have have explained myself better. I meant nothing else offers the power, torque and interior/spec for mid 30's. They are also really tuneable if you're insane. I appreciate many prefer better handling cars like the 981. We are all different but I personally wouldn't have a 240i or a mustang. I'd much rather have a m2 than a 240, even if it has the same awful, cheap interior. And the mustang is very basic compared to a m3 IMO. It also has a really tacky interior and is a bit of a barge. If you drove a 2017 comp pack I'm sure you'd have a different opinion. A 2014 car with the current software and KWs is even more planted. If I could afford one, I'd definitley take a 911 over a m3/4 though. I know most won't agree....but fashion grey is my fav colour too. Edited October 25, 2017 by Kev Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
un1eash Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Had my 5dr M140i for 6 months now. Its definitely more a GT then a sports car. They are very very quick with a ton of torque making the manual easy to live with in town, nearly all the B58 Mx40i's that have been dynod make more then the claimed 335bhp. The interior is almost identical to the 3/4 series and has a more quality feel now on the 1. I've fitted the rear under brace to mine to help stiffen the rear up which helps putting all that power down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docwra Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 un1eash, look into the M4 lower arms as well, they make a LOT of difference, if you ditch runflats at the same time its like a differet car I meant nothing else offers the power, torque and interior/spec for mid 30's. Apart from a C63. Or an E63, or a CL63 ....... you get the picture. Or an XFR, XJR. Or a Maserati, or a Bentley CGT. Or RS4/5/6. I could go on? The big difference between 1/2 and 3/4 is size, theres not a huge amount it but the smaler cars feel a lot more at home down a tight B road. Im supposed to be driving an M2 and an M3 in the very near future, at the moment the M3 Comp has it licked on looks alone but we will see ........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 5 hours ago, docwra said: un1eash, look into the M4 lower arms as well, they make a LOT of difference, if you ditch runflats at the same time its like a differet car Apart from a C63. Or an E63, or a CL63 ....... you get the picture. Or an XFR, XJR. Or a Maserati, or a Bentley CGT. Or RS4/5/6. I could go on? The big difference between 1/2 and 3/4 is size, theres not a huge amount it but the smaler cars feel a lot more at home down a tight B road. Im supposed to be driving an M2 and an M3 in the very near future, at the moment the M3 Comp has it licked on looks alone but we will see ........ C63, e63 or cl63 for mid 30's wouldn't match the interior or tech. Older AMG cars have aged badly IMO and look very dated. Especially the c63. I love the new c63 coupe but that's nowhere near mid 30's. I wouldnt dream of having a old Bentley cgt either. Interior is nice, but dated and the ownership costs are huge. Just like the v8 vantage. One of the worst purchases you can make IMHO. I imagine Peter stringfellow wannabes buy them. Maserati gt sport is nice, but heavily flawed and again looks dated in that price range. A 2014 m3/4 for mid 30's is impossible to beat as a package unless you're looking at older cars. Interior, exterior, spec, modern interior, DCT, brutally quick. What else comes close? They are are hard to beat new too. Especially with discounts and dealer contributions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 C63 at least sounds decent. It's a nicer place to be inside as well, although the Komand isn't quite as good as the iDrive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docwra Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 I wont get into individually linking cars but Im looking at buying something like this right now, C63/E63's are the same money for the same miles and same model year, so are XFR's, RS4/RS6's. Its not a coincidence IMO. Maserati Ghibli and Quattroporte are around the same money too ......... take 5 minutes on Autotrader, theres a lot of variety - Ill add V8 Mustang, Jag F Type and A45 Merc to the mix as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
un1eash Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 The M Lites attraction came from the fact you can pick up a brand new M140i for a little over £26k. This has changed now though and your looking at £29k for a standard 1 which is the same price for a 2 as they have bigger contributions from BMW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vish8895 Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 Up until last week I owned and daily'd a 135i M Sport Manual (Coupe). The older true twin turbo 3.0 inline 6 with 306bhp and 300ft-lb. The car was pehnominal, and was only weeks away from going stage 2 (decat downpipes, dual cone intakes, remap) and pushing an easy 400bhp. But it was robbed whilst I was at work, so now I am car-less and waiting for a payout so I can get a Z. I would 100% recommend one, the inline 6 turbo engines from BMW are a masterpiece, and it was my 2nd one! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangzoom Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 ^Sorry to hear about the car, crazy these days rather than work hard to get rewarded in life so many people prefer to just turn to crime :(. Hope at least insurance pays out, one thing I learnt from my recent claim a good insurance policy is worth payin for, even if cheaper policies are available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vish8895 Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 1 hour ago, gangzoom said: ^Sorry to hear about the car, crazy these days rather than work hard to get rewarded in life so many people prefer to just turn to crime :(. Hope at least insurance pays out, one thing I learnt from my recent claim a good insurance policy is worth payin for, even if cheaper policies are available. Yeah it is a right pain. That was my goal car, something I had pined after for years and in just 4 months it was taken! The sh*ty thing is, the current market value is approx 12K to get a like for like replacement, but the book value is around 10K for mine in mint condition, which it was. I have been doing hella research and even contacted the financial ombudsman service (who regulate the insurers over payouts) and they say that current adverts are not viable evidence of market value, and unless the car is rare or classic, the book value pretty much is the be all and end all :(. So I won't even be able to replace it with the payout, assuming I get top book value after fighting them on it. Also, what do you mean about paying for good insurance? I thought with car insurance it was all pretty much the same? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spatt Posted November 2, 2017 Author Share Posted November 2, 2017 ive digested some of the comments regarding more "prestige" models and though i can understand the points raised regarding the AMG range for example. yes, one could buy a C63 and it would be lovely and much joy would be had from it..... my friend has one i should know... the point we're missing here is running cost. The reason i feel the M lights have a strong (very strong) selling point in my opinion. Is running cost. looks at fuel, sure and we'll see its 'reasonable' but that't not the end of it. start looking into brakes, tyres and servicing and you could argue they are in fact one of the best value for money cars right now? as a box ticker i cant think of anything else Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vish8895 Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 I agree Spatt. My 135i would return 35mpg on a motorway run, and 30mpg in the week days (all a road driving). Servicing and mainteneance was not much more than any other mid range sports car. Whereas my e46 M3 needed new front discs and pads, coming in at around £600 in parts alone!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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