Zeezeebaba Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 I must be mad! With the imminent arrival of my new company hack and the prospect of a nice Elise weekender looming, attention has turned to the other half's replacement car next year. The model 3 has caught her eye and after doing some research Ive warmed to it a fair bit. Well quite a lot actually! (Don't tell GZ!) She is an accountant so the idea of no longer buying fuel speaks volumes to her and to be fair would free up a fair bit of cash a year for the household budget. Her daily is only used for the 15 mile trip to her office and back plus school runs etc. Add to this my tech savvy offspring being super keen for her to get one and the prospect looks more likely. I still need to look at order/delivery times and we may need to wait longer and keep her existing hack a while but as unlikely as it is I may have an EV on the drive within the year. I would like to apologise to all my petrol head chums in advance However it won't technically be my car anyway 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay84 Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 You're fine Zeezeebaba as you have a petrol head weekend car . I like the idea of an ev or hybrid for my company car as long as I get to keep my zed 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AliveBoy Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 You don't need to apologise, so long as the elise stays Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stutopia Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 This should be their bread and butter, cleans up air in towns and no range anxiety, makes perfect sense when you've got an emergency/fun real car too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikevv Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 I just CAN'T get over that interior.... Find it weird/gross, but as an economical run about I guess it's good. Sorry, I should have said " HUR DUR NO NOISE NEEDS V8 4 lyf" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangzoom Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 (edited) 9 hours ago, Zeezeebaba said: I may have an EV on the drive within the year. The 3 is a great looking car, and the reviews are bordering on fanatical... Apparently makes an Alfa Romeo feel like a 'wet sponge' in a back to back test drive.http://www.motortrend.com/cars/tesla/model-3/2018/exclusive-tesla-model-3-first-drive-review/ But if your wanting an EV this year it wouldn't be a Model 3....the pre order list is around 500k!!! US owners who pre ordered over a year ago are been told late 2018 delivery for AWD versiona. There is 0% change RHD cars will start coming down the line until the vast majority of US pre-order are fulfilled. I don't expect the first RHD cars to be in customer hands till late 2019/2020 :(. Still the timing works for us to replace my wife's hybrid, and after all I have a reputation to keep up as a Tesla fanboy:D Edited July 31, 2017 by gangzoom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeezeebaba Posted July 31, 2017 Author Share Posted July 31, 2017 I think a year is indeed optimistic but as I said she is willing to hang on to her existing car until then. Getting our names down for one is the first step and we shall see from there. I really like them and the interior was one of the selling points funnily enough 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangzoom Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 (edited) 46 minutes ago, Zeezeebaba said: I think a year is indeed optimistic but as I said she is willing to hang on to her existing car until then. Getting our names down for one is the first step and we shall see from there. I really like them and the interior was one of the selling points funnily enough I'm off to the states next months, going to see if I can get to see one in real life - though chances will be slim as I'll be on the East coast and not west. Although who knows, the last time I went I managed to see one of the first 100 Model X to come off the production line, ironically at the time I didn't like it and ended up ordering a S.......18 months and I'm waiting for delivery on my second white X, so clearly I cannot make up my mind on these cars at first viewing . What spec you going for? I'm half tended by the barebones base car - which is will have Autopilot 2.0 hardware anyways, and 0-60 in sub 6 seconds. At the same time the yet to be announced 'P' version might be hard to ignore, especially if it does sub 3 second 0-60 time and comes in under £50K . However one thing I've learnt from Tesla ownership the spec sheet and pricing changes on almost quarterly basis. The X options list and pricing has changed three times since we ordered our original car back in April last year. I'm pretty sure the Model 3 options in 2019 will look very different from today......and in a good way :). Edited July 31, 2017 by gangzoom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeezeebaba Posted July 31, 2017 Author Share Posted July 31, 2017 It would seem all are specced with the hardware necessary for additional add ons and automation later on. It would be the base car we go for and as cheap as possible. Even the Base has a quoted dash of 5.6 and a range over 200 miles so would be more than adequate for the missus. In fact it would be the fastest accelerating car she has ever owned 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangzoom Posted August 1, 2017 Share Posted August 1, 2017 ^ Hopefully the £4.5k EV grant will still be in place. The $ has tanked recently due to Trump, so if he can last till 2019 that would be perfect. If Tesla stick to their Model S pricing conversation, the cheapest 3 will come in at around £27k, that's barely anymore than what I paid for my Z back in 2005, and more than 50% cheaper than a S . The chepeast Tesla has always been the best value one, but a sub 3 second 0-60 time will be hard for me to ignore, having been loaned a P85D S for 48hrs recently it's the kind of unnecessary performance I would love to access on a quite Sunday 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted August 1, 2017 Share Posted August 1, 2017 British Gas have just announced a 12.5% increase in their electricity prices, so if you're on their network and own an EV then congrats! Your fuel price just jumped up 12.5%! And they say petrol prices are volatile. Given that electricity price rises are becoming steeper and more frequent (any homeowner will tell you that), you can see why EVs aren't going to be cheap to run forever. Not a dig at any one or anything, it's just not a point that I think has been raised elsewhere on here before. The overall cost of electric sure, but not the sudden double-digit price increases. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangzoom Posted August 1, 2017 Share Posted August 1, 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, Ekona said: British Gas have just announced a 12.5% increase in their electricity prices, so if you're on their network and own an EV then congrats! Your fuel price just jumped up 12.5%! And they say petrol prices are volatile. Given that electricity price rises are becoming steeper and more frequent (any homeowner will tell you that), you can see why EVs aren't going to be cheap to run forever. Not a dig at any one or anything, it's just not a point that I think has been raised elsewhere on here before. The overall cost of electric sure, but not the sudden double-digit price increases. A double digit percentage rise in electicty costs will see my fuel bill for the X increase from £120 to £134 for covering 6000 miles. I wonder how far £134 of petrol would get you in a 2.5 ton SUV capable of sub 5 second 0-60 sprints;). Edited August 1, 2017 by gangzoom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted August 2, 2017 Share Posted August 2, 2017 Congrats on missing the point. Go you! Now imagine a 10% raise every year, and then imagine average car mileage of 10,000 miles. And the raise happens overnight, not gradually, so you have no time to adjust. If you can't see why this might be a problem for Joe Average, then I give up. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ioneabee Posted August 2, 2017 Share Posted August 2, 2017 Content just for Gangzoom 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangzoom Posted August 2, 2017 Share Posted August 2, 2017 1 hour ago, Ekona said: Congrats on missing the point. Go you! Now imagine a 10% raise every year, and then imagine average car mileage of 10,000 miles. And the raise happens overnight, not gradually, so you have no time to adjust. If you can't see why this might be a problem for Joe Average, then I give up. A 100% price increase on something that costs 1p translates to an absolute cost increase of 1p. A 1% price increase on something that costs 100p translates to an absolute cost increase of 1p. If you can budget for a 1% cost increase for a product that costs 100p you can afford a multiple 100% increases in price on a product that costs 1p with no planning at all. We can both agree that we don't see eye to eye about EVs. As I keep on saying ultimately what we agree/disagree on is pointless, time will tell how things will change (or not change) :). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangzoom Posted August 2, 2017 Share Posted August 2, 2017 (edited) 3 hours ago, Ekona said: Congrats on missing the point. Go you! Now imagine a 10% raise every year, and then imagine average car mileage of 10,000 miles. And the raise happens overnight, not gradually, so you have no time to adjust. If you can't see why this might be a problem for Joe Average, then I give up. A Model 3 is projected to have a real life efficiency of 4.5 miles per kWh (similar to my old Leaf and much better than the X). So 10,000 miles will use 2300kWh. For me with charging the car on E7 rates overnight that translates to a yearly fuel cost of £138. A efficient combustion car doing a real life 40mpg and fuel costing £1.10/l will cost £1250. I'll leave you to do the maths on how many 10% fuel rises it'll take to turn £138 into £1250. And I suspect if you asked Joe Average which if those two sums is easier to budget for the, answer will be obvious. .....actually done the maths, it's 23 consecutive 10% changes needed, so that will take us to 2040....Guess we'll have to wait till than to settle this one :). Edited August 2, 2017 by gangzoom 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davey_83 Posted August 2, 2017 Share Posted August 2, 2017 I like the 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
un1eash Posted August 2, 2017 Share Posted August 2, 2017 All this talk about saving money on fuel, have we forgot what Tesla's cost to buy new. Even if we see a £35k Tesla 3 on UK roads, that's still nearly £10k more then my current car. Even at 20mpg, £113p a litre that's nearly 39000 miles to make up the difference. I won't even consider a change until an EV saves me a decent amount of money over a petrol car. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeezeebaba Posted August 2, 2017 Author Share Posted August 2, 2017 The thing that's sold me on the 3 isn't just the running cost but the factoring in of the purchase price within that cost. My main gripe initially with Tesla was the cost of buying one. Finally we have an affordable option here in a practical package. My other half was starting to warm to Tesla long before me as one of her clients has an S, his car I believe cost around the 98k mark but was filtered through his business justifying the purchase somewhat. One of my current clients is Thatcham Research in Berkshire, I have seen first hand several S models that have undergone crash lab testing and the guys there really rate the safety on the brand. Seeing as they rate vehicles for the insurance sector I believe them wholeheartedly. The outer structure and deformation is extremely impressive whilst retaining an amazing level of occupant protection. A 26k dummy full of electronics doesn't lie The 3 although smaller follows this vein but unfortunately I won't see that tested because I'm changing employer in October. So we have a car that for family transport for someone who clocks up 15k miles a year is extremely safe and cheap to run all for the price of a new family car. For us this is no brainer territory. I have requested an economic golf sized hatch for my new company hack and will of course be able to afford my petrol head weekender. We have come to the conclusion it's a perfect balance as a family and keeps everyone happy including the banks My 20 year old son who rarely accompanies us anywhere these days is a tech freak and can't wait to get his hands on a 3! My youngest daughter has also tipped the scales in favour of a Tesla. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilogikal1 Posted August 2, 2017 Share Posted August 2, 2017 (edited) On 01/08/2017 at 06:08, gangzoom said: If Tesla stick to their Model S pricing conversation, the cheapest 3 will come in at around £27k... 6 hours ago, gangzoom said: A Model 3 is projected to have... Along with countless other assumptions; if they don't, or that projection is wrong, your arguments fall flat on their face. This is the problem with trying to work out or persuade anyone based on how much it'll save or cost them because nothing about the 3 has been confirmed, much less born out yet, so you're left with nothing more than guessing either way. I mean, if everyone starts driving EV's today the demand, and therefore cost, of both EV's and electricity will increase and that of petrol will decrease, urgo [insert invented and assumptive maths here] proving that it'll be cheaper to buy a 8 litre V12 by next Tuesday. Or something. Edited August 2, 2017 by ilogikal1 Spellage fix 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangzoom Posted August 2, 2017 Share Posted August 2, 2017 2 hours ago, un1eash said: All this talk about saving money on fuel, have we forgot what Tesla's cost to buy new. Which why am amazed out of all the 'issues' you can raise about the cost of an EV someone goes and picks on fuel costs....which there is no argument about just how much cheaper electricity is than petrol :). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
un1eash Posted August 2, 2017 Share Posted August 2, 2017 So basically spend more money now to save money tomorrow, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G1en Posted August 2, 2017 Share Posted August 2, 2017 Again, another assumption everyone is making is current cost of electric versus petrol. But the retail cost is not the true cost. The vat on household electric is 5% if i read my quarterly statement correct. The vat on fuel will be 20% and then the Fuel duty of 58p per ltr (equates to over 50% currently.) What i am getting at is the disparity between the nett cost and consumer cost. If everyone went electric tomorrow whats to say the goverment wont up the vat on electric or put a duty on each kw used to claw back the millions they are gonna lose from no petrol/deisel sales. Its like every reply i watch in politics. Someone promises something and someone else replies with, "where is the money coming from?" Its got to come from somewhere. Anyway, rant over. The main point was petrol would not be expensive if it wasnt for those pesky kids (i mean government) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangzoom Posted August 2, 2017 Share Posted August 2, 2017 42 minutes ago, un1eash said: So basically spend more money now to save money tomorrow, Do you really think I've bought at £75K+ brand new car and pre-ordered another £35K+ one to save money?? I'm pretty sure we are all on this forum because we love cars, and the absolute cost of motoring come secondary to the driving experience. I love our X not because it costs pennies to run interim of fuel cost (which isn't a bad thing), I love it because its simply the best car I have ever owned. It can carry my family in safety, move a sofa without problems, but still as fun to blast around a B road as any of my past cars (DC2 Teg excluded). I realised am lucky to be able to afford an EV right now, but that's what the Model 3 is here to do, lower the price of entry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangzoom Posted August 2, 2017 Share Posted August 2, 2017 (edited) 4 hours ago, Zeezeebaba said: One of my current clients is Thatcham Research in Berkshire, I have seen first hand several S models that have undergone crash lab testing and the guys there really rate the safety on the brand. Seeing as they rate vehicles for the insurance sector I believe them wholeheartedly. The outer structure and deformation is extremely impressive whilst retaining an amazing level of occupant protection. A 26k dummy full of electronics doesn't lie The 3 although smaller follows this vein but unfortunately I won't see that tested because I'm changing employer in October. When I was offered the settlement check for my written off X I did look at alternatives (iPace in particular) , but when you consider just how lives can be changed in an instant with tragic consequences . Having my family in the safest car on the road really was a no-brainer decision, and why I was willing to put spend another £4.5K of my own money to ensure we got another X as the family wagon. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-devon-40800157 When I saw structure integrity of the Model 3 in a crash test versus the safety combustion car on the market the decision to pre-order the Model 3 became a no-brainer. It very much looks like the Model 3 will follow in the foot steps of the S/X as been one of the safest cars on the planet to have a crash in Edited August 2, 2017 by gangzoom 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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