The 2017 GE & Politics Thread

[coldel]

The referendum last year was not legally binding and advisory only, unlike the AV vote a few years before which was legally binding. 17.4m wanted out, 16.1m wanted in, 13m didn't bother voting which was a shame as that would have given us a proper view of the will of the people. Anyway from a simplistic view of our divorce from Europe (and purely speculating), there is a predetermined end date which we haven't reached and nothing written in law to say we cannot back out, so if all parties involved i.e. all EU states and the UK agree, it could be rescinded? All that said, I don't think any politician in their right mind would reverse it, Tories have their rhetoric on it so do Labour with their views on passing the decision in parliament. Libs wont get enough of a say in any coalition (sounds familiar!) to make any impact on that.

 

I think it will be a tory win, labour lose seats, libs gain some, UKIP fade back with no actual manifesto. Corbyn grimly hang in there post election and ends up getting shoved out kicking and screaming.

[AliveBoy]

I just hope that all of the touchy feely types in my generation don't vote for the likes of the greens, JC, cannabis party etc

[JetSet]

So if Labour crash and loose more seats, what then, another leadership battle with JC standing "again" and being voted in "again"?

 

Yes, JC is very popular with labour party members/activists and getting slammed in a general election won't change this. The voting public, like me for example see him in a different light, weak,especially on defence and leading a disunited party. This isn't going to end well for the labour party.

 

Pete

[coldel]

Interestingly, polls are getting worse for predicting outcomes in votes, asking people who they think will win is more likely to be accurate...

[Ekona]

You would think that if Labour get as badly slaughtered in the election as the polls predict, even the most devout of Corbynistas would run out of patience and bin the guy off. I admire him for (mostly) standing by his principles, but principles are useless if your party has no chance of power whilst you're in charge. The UK desperately needs a strong Opposition, so I'm hoping that he would do the decent thing and give someone else a go if he fails.

[Jetpilot]

Like he did last time

[Ekona]

 

Well, in fairness he's not faced a GE yet, so let's see what happens. He may surprise us all!

[Jetpilot]

I dont think he is the problem, as above i guess he genuinely thinks he is the man for Labour, even if his party and their voters dont, its the unions and other fools voting him back in, talk about burying your head in the sand and flogging a dead horse.

[Stutopia]

I'm certain Corbyn will quit after a loss, particularly if it's heavy. His whole position is about having a mandate, a loss at an election erodes that. Also, I'm quite sure he'll be exhausted from fighting both the Labour Tories and the actual Tories by that point!

 

It'll be interesting to see who it actually is the Labour MPs have been wanting all along, so far the "electable" superstar candidate they've been on about doesn't actually exist!

[sasha@lazytrips]

I'm certain Corbyn will quit after a loss, particularly if it's heavy. His whole position is about having a mandate, a loss at an election erodes that. Also, I'm quite sure he'll be exhausted from fighting both the Labour Tories and the actual Tories by that point!

 

It'll be interesting to see who it actually is the Labour MPs have been wanting all along, so far the "electable" superstar candidate they've been on about doesn't actually exist!

 

Disagree. Think it's pretty clear that Chuka Umunna is the next leader. He will wait for the loss before coming through as there is no way for him to around the Labour deficit before then...

[Stutopia]

I think he will be good, but it's a shame he didn't fancy standing in a contest. It's clever/cowardly depending on how you view political operating.

[Irn Bru]

Don't really care as long as that moron Diane Abbot gets booted into the long grass, cannot for the life of me see where her voting appeal is. I think the local elections up and down the UK will give a good indicator of how it's going to pan out, and I'm expecting a lot of bloody noses up here.

 

I actually think what she's doing is the right thing, as in her thinking that the EU negotiations will need the backing of the people, so that way at least when she gets re elected, she's got the mandate from the uk voters to drive the negotiations forward instead of fighting the EU and our own mp's.

 

Also, anybody think that all leave voters, where ever their party loyalty's lie will vote for TM, and the remainers will still vote for the party they have historically voted for, which would divvy down Labours and libs and snp's vote share. If that pans out then the Cons will have a huge majority

[Jetpilot]

Purely my opinion,

 

Only the die hard ukip, labour and lib dem voters will be voting for their relevant parties, which I would imagine leaves a fair chunk looking with a fair bit of pondering to do.

 

How do you think NS will fair, would loosing a big majority make her or her party sit and up and take notice if that were to happen?

[Irn Bru]

Purely my opinion,

 

Only the die hard ukip, labour and lib dem voters will be voting for their relevant parties, which I would imagine leaves a fair chunk looking with a fair bit of pondering to do.

 

How do you think NS will fair, would loosing a big majority make her or her party sit and up and take notice if that were to happen?

 

Like I said bud, the local elections will be a good indicator. All the party's up here are trying to make it a council election, which it is but I think everybody will vote like it's a GE tbh. Snp is taking a lot of flak atm, but there is still no viable opposition in scotland now, there is no real contender to them, which is great if your snp and want a one party country (which is a dictatorship in my eyes), the real problem in politics just now up and down the UK is the sheer weakness and unelectability of candidates. I'm no tory voter but I also dislike snp' s grip on scotland and their current policies, so there is a strong chance I'd vote conservative as a tactical vote, but there again I can't stand Ruth Davidson. It's a real pity that in these "exciting political times" theres a real shed load of shitty candidates

[JetSet]

You would think that if Labour get as badly slaughtered in the election as the polls predict, even the most devout of Corbynistas would run out of patience and bin the guy off.

 

The Labour party has been hijacked by the left and hard left idealists and those to the centre left have been pushed to one side. If Corbyn doesn't resign then I don't see how the moderate wing of the Labour party can be rid of him. Of course its entirely their own fault, changing the way the party elects its leader then throwing open membership for a fiver may raise a lot of money but has left them wide open to infiltration.

 

Pete

[formatzero]

I don't think Labour could be trusted with the economy,they would likely borrow loads of cash to fund their policies and leave us with huge debts.May gets a lot of stick,particularly from S.N.P but I think you have to give her some credit,she was a remainer but at least had the guts to take on the task given by the electorate to tackle brexit !Cameron on the other hand jumped ship! I too believe it will be interesting in Scotland,will Queen Nicola lose a few seats? I think she might .

Edited April 18, 2017 by formatzero

[Fodder]

I think it's quite clever by May, she's outlined her vision of Brexit so either she gets full parliamentary support for it or it's someone else's problem..... more ballsy than Cameron's resignation because he didn't want to deal with it if you ask me.

[Jetpilot]

Purely my opinion,

 

Only the die hard ukip, labour and lib dem voters will be voting for their relevant parties, which I would imagine leaves a fair chunk looking with a fair bit of pondering to do.

 

How do you think NS will fair, would loosing a big majority make her or her party sit and up and take notice if that were to happen?

 

Like I said bud, the local elections will be a good indicator. All the party's up here are trying to make it a council election, which it is but I think everybody will vote like it's a GE tbh. Snp is taking a lot of flak atm, but there is still no viable opposition in scotland now, there is no real contender to them, which is great if your snp and want a one party country (which is a dictatorship in my eyes), the real problem in politics just now up and down the UK is the sheer weakness and unelectability of candidates. I'm no tory voter but I also dislike snp' s grip on scotland and their current policies, so there is a strong chance I'd vote conservative as a tactical vote, but there again I can't stand Ruth Davidson. It's a real pity that in these "exciting political times" theres a real shed load of shitty candidates

 

I am not so sure its the candidates, whilst ever i think TM is doing a good job with what she has been handed, i wouldnt say she is a vote winner, its just the party giving the people what they want (well 51%), same goes for NS, i cant believe she is/was the vote winner, more the snp are or were representing the majority. JC and labour just seems stuck in a 70's union time warp and arent listening.

 

I changed my vote for the first time at the last election and It was nothing to do with candidates, just the party represented me much better, although i appreciate a lot will vote for a personality.

 

I doubt the Tories would have even won last time around if they hadnt promised the referendum.

[coldel]

I think Theresa Maybe (and there is a reason she is known as that) lacks leadership qualities all over the place, she seems weak, not as weak as Corbyn but given her previous roles where she ummed and urred on issues and made some glaring mistakes nothing appears to have changed in this role. She has called this so that she gets some breathing space on Brexit, the government sat on their hands for 8-10 months dithering on Brexit since the vote and now realise that they cannot possibly get anywhere substantial in the time left. So they have taken a vote now which they know they will win so that they are not faced with a GE a year after they have in all likelihood failed to achieve and agree an exit agreement in 2019.

[Ebized]

Whilst TM has clearly decided she wants a vote of confidence, quietly I bet she hopes it will lead to huge egg on face for JC and he finally gets the message to give up the leadership. My guess is she would prefer a more effective Labour leader that represents the wider views of the 'opposition' than just those who seem to be stuck in th seventies. He is another Michael Foot - stuck in left wing politics that does the Labour Party no good at all. Being challenged by a more creditable opposition leader would be far more welcome to help TM tailor the Brexit negotiations to to represent the majority of the population.

 

OK, putting aside the die-hards who would only ever vote for 'their' party, we all know it is the majority of the population who the Parties look to convince which way they vote and whilst some will tick the boxes of the minority Parties.......or just not vote at all, TM knows she has the best chance atm to get her and the Conservatives back in. Most voters will surely be thinking that way and the only danger is too many don't bother to vote as the outcome is all too predictable.

[coldel]

...and TM has just ruled out appearing in a TV debate because quite frankly she would get put over a barrel, she simply isn't good enough and knows it, she would only come out damaging the Tories current standing. Good opportunity for the others though to stand up and try and shift the focus to their parties though.

[Stutopia]

I hope the TV companies will have the good grace to leave one empty podium on stage, a little reminder of the disdain with which she holds the merest thought of having to explain policy to the proletariat.

[coldel]

Ironically her excuse is that she prefers to go out and meet people face to face, which really seems the strangest thing to say when the TV debates give millions, not hundreds (which she will reach door knocking) the chance to see her - get with the times. But as I say, she is bottling it as she isn't good enough and she knows it. I like the idea of the empty podium. Almost like the whole 'unity/stability' rubbish as the reason for the snap GE.

 

I get that politicians sometimes have to invent reasons for their actions, but the inventiveness of her advisors is pretty poor

[Jay84]

She should get herself on twitter/fb/snapchat, and meet the people that way. Otherwise she'll never make it around the whole country before June.

[Ekona]

As interesting as the TV debates were to watch, they added very little to things other than give a headline to the Daily Mail. Remember in 2010 when Nick Clegg was amazing on TV when no-one had heard of him, and his party got a crap load of votes based purely on that rather than any actual depth to the LD policies? Yeah, look how that ended up: People then realised just *why* no-one had ever voted for them in decent numbers after seeing the nonsense they came out with! IMHO debates about policies and who you should be voting for is something that should be taken at face value going on previous history and what is actually written down, not soundbites and how well someone comes across on TV.

 

TM seems a far stronger leader than DC to me, and whilst I didn't necessarily agree with her actions as Home Secretary she's appears to be significantly better and more forthright as a party leader. As I've said, I don't think this was the right call for a snap GE, however I'd much rather have a PM that is flexible enough to realise when something isn't really working and needs changing, rather than stick blindly with something just because they don't want to be seen as 'going back on their word'. That is the kind of useless nonsense that has to be erased from modern politics, as all it does it leave us stuck in the stone ages.

 

 

As for a TV debate without the PM, that debate then loses all credibility and given that the other parties broadly agree that the Tories are evil, it won't be much of a debate if they all just stand there and agree with each other all night!