Jetpilot Posted March 2, 2017 Author Share Posted March 2, 2017 I think you mean we're, not you're. Well, we're going to see about that. Uk independence, scottish independence, whats the difference, you dont want to be ruled by the majority of the uk voting public but happy to be ruled by the eu, I truly hope you get what you want Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 Don't poke the angry Scot!!!11 Back on track, this is a great article 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-G- Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 I think you mean we're, not you're. Well, we're going to see about that. Uk independence, scottish independence, whats the difference, you dont want to be ruled by the majority of the uk voting public but happy to be ruled by the eu, I truly hope you get what you want Let me explain why that's a load of utter b0ll0cks. The UK shares a small part of its sovereignty with the EU, mostly in the aim of homogenization of trade, human rights & the laws underpinning both - but the EU cannot force the UK to say, house nuclear weapons from Germany on its soil anymore than it can impose punitive electricity transmission charges based on how far away our power stations are from Brussels. (Yes, that happens in Scotland because we're soooo far away from London) Scotland shares NO sovereignty with England as part of the UK. The only illusion of sovereignty we get is if what we vote for happens to be mirrored in England. A single MP here voted for the renewal of Trident, but despite this, it's happening anyway. Nobody voted for a conservative government or for Brexit, either but we're expected to get on with it, despite the majority voting against it. Three years ago we were promised the earth if we voted no by 3 arseh0le politicians who aren't even in charge of their respective parties anymore - instead we got the neutering of Scottish MP's at Westminster to satisfy a horde of unhappy Mail & Express readers who have been spoon-fed racist, anti-scottish horseshit for the last 20 years. The Yes Camp started-off at 28% of the vote in 2011 and finished at 45% in 2014 - If anyone seriously thinks that none of the above is going to count for something in the minds of voters this time around, they're mental. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetpilot Posted March 2, 2017 Author Share Posted March 2, 2017 Scotland is part of the Uk, far longer the the Uk has been part of the Eu, you dont really want independence, you just dont want to be part of the Uk and dont want to adhere to the majority vote, I wonder how much you will have to give to be part of the eu when you have to apply to be a member, you think you got a bum deal from westminster and the majority vote, think scotland may have as much of a shock as you think we have got coming, that is if persuade your brothers to actually pluck up the courage next time around. Enjoy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricey Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 IBTL. Not used that one for a while 😂 Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetSet Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 Back on topic, were the House of Lords right to amend the Brexit bill. We can certainly argue about the make up of the Lords, but as I understand it there is an agreement not to block government bills that were on that party's manifesto and Brexit was not on anyone's manifesto (apart from UKIP's). That's why we have a second chamber, to stop governments pushing through bills at will, I mean what is the point in having a second house if it just rubber stamps every bill it's presented with? Anyway, can anyone seriously believe that Germany of all countries will expel U.K citizens? The reasons that people go to Germany isn't to work on farms picking fruit or to get a suntan. Most Brits in Germany work in skilled jobs such as engineering and many are married to Germans. While its true that the majority of Brits who leave The U.K go to places like Spain, Portugal, France (Brittany is very popular) and Italy, these people contribute to the local economy in a significant way. Most E.U citizens come here to work or have married Brits, you would have to off your rocker to come here to retire . So can anyone envisage us sending E.U citizens home, for a start you would need some serious manpower to track down and forceably remove the estimated 2 million E.U citizens and the cost would be astronomical. So IMHO, what the Lords did was well within its authority but in reality looks like nothing more than a delaying tactic. Pete . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetpilot Posted March 3, 2017 Author Share Posted March 3, 2017 Some good points re being a safeguard, but this has come through the house of commons with little resistance from the other parties, its not like the Tories are forcing it through on their majority. Unlected or not i have to say i think TM has been pretty good with all of this However, it just seems like a massive performance, lets just get it done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aashenfox Posted March 3, 2017 Share Posted March 3, 2017 (edited) I'm sure they are looking to see what we do first before putting anything in place. These people, in the most part, contribute to our society, so why would we cut more of our nose off. I can't see there being a mandate from the EU that all UK citizens have to move back to the UK. There are already a myriad of nationalities (Non-EU) across the EU (Living and working) and they aren't going to send all those back as well. So we give up our bargaining chip, as Ekona says above, why would the Germans not just agree to a like for like deal? The Germans aren't the EU. It's a genuine concern for people like me...will I need a visa to live here next year? Will my driving license still be valid? Of course the 99% probable answer to those is No, and Yes, but you never know, I have no guarantees at this point. I feel totally let down and unrepresented by the British gov't. I literally cannot believe that such a wide ranging and sweeping change to the face of the civilised world, throwing away as worthless 40 years of relationship building and cooperation, can be enacted on a 5% majority!? The world has gone mad. Edited March 3, 2017 by Aashenfox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetpilot Posted March 3, 2017 Author Share Posted March 3, 2017 (edited) You have totally missed the point, the very reason the british government wont sign off on eu citizens rights in the UK is because at the moment the UE is not guaranteeing your rights in the EU as a British Citizen, they are totally representing you on this. Edited March 3, 2017 by Jetpilot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stutopia Posted March 3, 2017 Share Posted March 3, 2017 Ideologically, I think the Lords, if required at all, needs to be an elected second chamber. Given their actual incarnation, if they're not happy about something then it's their duty to pass it back to HoC. It doesn't matter whether it's something like Brexit, which has driven previously politically disinterested people (on both sides) to hitherto unseen levels of hysteria, or if it's a small element of a less emotive piece. Let's face it, how many HoL threads have we had prior to Brexit? How many people had to be told the Judiciary were enemies of the people, prior to Brexit? The whole discussion structure is tainted now by this incredibly emotive subject, making it more or less impossible to separate the genuine reformers from the "I don't like the last thing they did" mob. Next month the HoL will be failing to trouble the front pages. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted March 3, 2017 Share Posted March 3, 2017 Exactly. It's worked perfectly fine for the last few hundred years... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aashenfox Posted March 3, 2017 Share Posted March 3, 2017 You have totally missed the point, the very reason the british government wont sign off on eu citizens rights in the UK is because at the moment the UE is not guaranteeing your rights in the EU as a British Citizen, they are totally representing you on this. Sorry, my bad, I wasn't feeling unsupported because of the bill amendment, you're right, that works against me, the govt is trying to leave that section blank on purpose until it can get a reciprocal deal for people like me (which by the way, is the exact type of tit-for-tat politics that is ruining the world, when will we learn to trust one another), what I meant was the whole Brexit thing, sorry, I should have clarified, because the topic is about the House of Lords and I can see why you would think I meant that. Cheers! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted March 3, 2017 Share Posted March 3, 2017 Trust? Politics? BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA nope. Never. It'll all be fine. Nothing will really change in the end, promise. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldel Posted March 3, 2017 Share Posted March 3, 2017 I think with reference to people and their status it will all be fine on both sides. The sort of confrontational politics we see by the likes of Farage doesn't help things at all, it only makes their opposite number act in a similar manner, but I am pretty hopeful that sensible people outside the likes of Farage et al. will just realise that the cost and upheaval to both economies is just too ridiculous to fathom if we all decided to uproot everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aashenfox Posted March 3, 2017 Share Posted March 3, 2017 I'm sure it will be, which is why it's such a debacle. Fight tooth and nail to leave an agreement, only to reinstall as much of it as possible under a different name. wtf. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.