Hiro Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Hello, With an NA engine this is probably not ideal, but with a built engine, the supercharger seems limited due to impeller speed of the unit. Just curious if anyone has had their supercharger rebuilt to spin faster? If so, was here a noticeable gain and was it cost effective? Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ebized Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Some info here if you have not already found it: http://www.350z-uk.com/topic/82588-vortech-supecharging-technical-and-reliability-thread/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMballistic Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 With the Vortech supercharger (as with lots of others too) you change the drive pulleys to increase power (giving higher Psi boost). There is also a toothed pulley you can change as well for increased performance I believe. Belts & pulleys from Torqen for example: https://www.torqen.uk/130-belts-pulleys-oil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hiro Posted January 6, 2017 Author Share Posted January 6, 2017 Thanks for the information. Ebized, I've already ready through the link posted a while back and did my oil catch can set-up with Bennett's info on positive crankcase ventilation. Thank for the refresher on the link though. GMBallistic, I see what you are saying about upgrading the pulleys but I think that the reason for this is to affect impeller speed in the end thus creating more air flow and more power. The only change I've made regarding a pulley was the crank pulley and that is because I have a built engine and when building it I used a Fluidamper over the OEM one. Regarding a tooth pulley, which pulley are you referring to specifically? I'm still convinced, but I could be wrong, that all these mods are to get the Vortech to spin faster or to spin faster sooner, thus affecting more power to come in sooner. Regardless, there is a max impeller speed and when this is reached I'm sure there is a threshold for over spinning the blower which is why I'm concerned. I don't see a stock engine running into this issue so much with standard pulleys and what not as I'm sure Horsham and Abbey know the limits of the engines with the Vortech on a stock motor. With a built engine, the capabilities are much higher, but if the blower is impeller speed limited, those capabilities would not be attainable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMballistic Posted January 6, 2017 Share Posted January 6, 2017 The pulleys you can change are not the ones on the engine fyi. They are the pulleys that are the drive pulleys for the supercharger itself. For example I used a 3.12 pulley on mine like this: https://www.torqen.uk/nissan/350z/turbos-superchargers/belts-pulleys-oil/1780-350z-vortech-6-rib-312-supercharger-drive-pulley-v2a036-312.html ....but you can go more extreme with a 2.62 being the furthest you can go with those pulleys I believe. You "may" need to change injectors though depending on what you're running with increased boost & power as you'll need to be supplying the engine with more fuel. This is an example of the toothed pulley I mean: https://www.torqen.uk/nissan/350z/turbos-superchargers/belts-pulleys-oil/1789-350z-vortech-28-tooth-count-supercharger-pulley-4gr033-028.html For the non-REVUP kits, the 3.12 pulley adds about 25whp more than the stock 3.33 pulley while the 2.87 pulley adds about 30whp more than the 3.12. There's also another step up you can do with changing the cog pulley that drives the 2nd smaller belt attached to the vortech. Changing it to a 34 tooth pulley can possibly give you more power too, however some people experienced a power loss with the 2.87+34/28 cog setup. IMO the stock 3.33 pulley isn't very impressive. The stock pulley for most people feels like it's doing too little, too late. Upgrading the pulley(s) brings the boost on sooner and gives you more of it, making the car much more exciting to drive. IMO a basic Stillen supercharger is going to be a much more exciting setup to drive compared to the stock pulley. Bear in mind that as you go to smaller pulleys, your fuel requirements increase Source: http://my350z.com/forum/forced-induction/270770-vortech-faq-read-this-before-asking-vortech-questions.html ^^ Have a good read of that thread I've linked above as it answered pretty much every question I had about Vortech superchargers before I fitted mine. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumping350 Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 what power are you aiming at? do you have S/C fitted already? depending what supercharger you have you can get a trimmed one which spins faster than the original but I think that involves buying a different supercharger all together. As GM mentions the pulley on the Supercharger can be changed for smaller ones to increase HP (along with the belt) and this is most common method of extracting more power with what you have already got. The faster it spins the more chance of belt slip also so you have to take that into account and there is a support bar you can buy to combat this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hiro Posted January 9, 2017 Author Share Posted January 9, 2017 Thanks again for the added information. GM, thanks for the links. I remember the thread for years ago way before I did my build and supercharger and it was quite helpful at that time. Futhermore, I think I wasn't that specific in my last post as I was addressing the root cause of why someone would want to upgrade pulleys for a supercharged system. I'm already running the upgraded 3.12 pulley from the standard 3.33. I would have gone with the 2.87 but I'm already pushing past the max impeller speed with the current set-up. My engine is built with Cosworth pistons, Eagle rods, and supertech valves and I'm also running the larger Fluidamper crank pulley which is 6.125 I believe over the stock 5.75. This was recommended by the builder when my crank was balanced. Because of this upgrade I'm also pushing close to the same impeller speeds as one one get running the 2.87 pulley with a standard sized crank pulley. Additionally, I was able to push the engine up to 7100 rpms on VQ35DE non-rev up engine since the internals are forged. Abbey did not do the build but they did do the initial mapping on the dyno and mapping after the engine was broken in. Since it was being supercharged, I was going to stick with a 10:3 compression ration like stock, but instead Mark at Abbey suggested going with 10:1. Needless to say, I made 423hp on Marks dyno at the hubs which he said is around 455bhp. Later I went to Horsham and had a remap and made 452bhp. I have owned this car since 2004 and been running on a built engine with supercharger since the fall of 2013. All the other things that most people do I have already done as well to include a CJM Stage 1 Fuel system, Injector Dynamics injectors, oil cooler (although I found it unnecessary), and the list goes on. Can't remember everything since it was 3 years ago now but I have several upgrades in my build internally and in supporting mods. The reason I posted this message is because it seems that most people are making power in the same power range, so regardless of having a built engine or not I'm not really making any more power than anyone else, I just have an engine that can handle those numbers safely. If all the supporting mods are there and if the engine can handle it, then the limitation to me is the supercharger itself. I could be wrong, so please chime in if you have another opinion. On the Vortech website there is a part on there where you can put in information to determine the impeller speed based on the vortech unit being used, the crank pulley size, and the supercharger pulley. It seems that page is not there anymore since Vortech changed their site and another site I used seems to be giving me different numbers. With a Turbo I could just turn the boost up, but on the supercharger we have to upgrade the supercharger pulley. I just wish I was advised about the other trims before I bought my V3 Sci. I knew I didn't want the T-trim, mainly due to being loud but the Si looked more promising. I believe a shop called 928 motorsports does upgrades for superchargers, but not sure if anyone here has used them or even bothered trying to upgrade the supercharger. Jumping350, it would be nice to make over 500 to be honest. But, really, I'd rather have useable power instead of a high peak hp. I'm not too concerned with belt slip as I have the GTM pulley mod and the Timrod radius bar kit for the supercharger bracket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMballistic Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 Yep I can understand what you're saying. My supercharged Zed made 436Bhp on Horshams dyno and that was on a stock engine so yours is only got around 16Bhp on what mine had and that's with yours having a built motor. If you're chasing numbers have you changed your exhaust manifolds? I'm guessing you would have. What about your cams? Did you get those changed when you had the motor built? Horsham posted just the other week of a DE engine rebuild they did with HKS cams which gave great results: http://www.350z-uk.com/topic/113640-350z-de-engine-build/ Sorry not on the supercharger I know, just spit balling ideas. If you have a look here you're definitely making good power though compared with a lot of the other FI'd Zeds on here (past & present): http://www.350z-uk.com/topic/66265-official-list-of-uk-fi-zeds/page__st__140 Maybe worth having a conversation with Adrian from Torqen to see if he can find out any information for you from Vortech as he deals with them. Unfortunately I don't know anything about changing the Vortech impellers for increased performance although I am aware of it (from my Subaru Turbo days). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilscorp Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 What intercooler do you have and what fuel pump? From your list I would expect higher numbers than you are getting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajvindiesel Posted May 24, 2020 Share Posted May 24, 2020 Interesting reading. Mine is booked in for the V3 supercharger. They fit an intercooler but I do t know if it's a std intercooler or whether a higher spec Intercooler would get more out of the F.I., should I request a better intercooler? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Posted May 24, 2020 Share Posted May 24, 2020 3 hours ago, ajvindiesel said: Interesting reading. Mine is booked in for the V3 supercharger. They fit an intercooler but I do t know if it's a std intercooler or whether a higher spec Intercooler would get more out of the F.I., should I request a better intercooler? I think you should have done a lot more research before you sent your car off for it to be installed. who’s doing the installation? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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