3D Printed my own Velocity Stack Mod.

[GMballistic]

Not meaning to put a dampener on your idea Lewis/CS but it is a concern (imo) to the life expectancy of this part with it being constantly subjected to varying temperatures which may lead to part degradation.

I understand you are planning on using ABS filament which in itself has a better resistance to higher temperatures than PLA filament and although it does have good strength properties it is as yet a totally untested part in the environment you're putting it in.

 

Just airing more on the side of caution with the part itself being passed the filtration area for the engine meaning that if any break down of the part did happen, no matter how minor it would without doubt be sucked into the engine so anyone intending to fit these would need to be well aware of the "possible" risk they may be taking.

 

 

Also with regards to selling these on the forum cs2000 you would need to get in contact with glrnet (Graham) in order to re-open your trader status/account.

[Lewis_UK]

Sweet

 

I'm test printing now, I'm amazed at how hot you need to print to properly print in ABS. With PLA, a nozzle temperature of 160 and a bed of 60 is plenty!

 

I bumped this up to 190 and 90, and the ABS prints, but the layers don't stick together (but it did adhere to the bed! so the bed temp is good) so I bumped it up to 220 and it stuck much better, but still not perfect, so now trying another at 230! lol hot hot hot!

 

I will speak to my colleague tomorrow/friday in regards to temp of print, I think it was close to the 250 mark.

 

Not meaning to put a dampener on your idea Lewis/CS but it is a concern (imo) to the life expectancy of this part with it being constantly subjected to varying temperatures which may lead to part degradation.

I understand you are planning on using ABS filament which in itself has a better resistance to higher temperatures than PLA filament and although it does have good strength properties it is as yet a totally untested part in the environment you're putting it in.

 

Just airing more on the side of caution with the part itself being passed the filtration area for the engine meaning that if any break down of the part did happen, no matter how minor it would without doubt be sucked into the engine so anyone intending to fit these would need to be well aware of the "possible" risk they may be taking.

 

 

Also with regards to selling these on the forum cs2000 you would need to get in contact with glrnet (Graham) in order to re-open your trader status/account.

 

Thanks for you concern GM, I never considered this really. I naturally assumed that because of the temp required to mold the print, and the intake temps from the Zed, this would not be an issue.

I think I'm going to do daily checks to be sure. I did check today, all still solid.

[cs2000]

Not meaning to put a dampener on your idea Lewis/CS but it is a concern (imo) to the life expectancy of this part with it being constantly subjected to varying temperatures which may lead to part degradation.

I understand you are planning on using ABS filament which in itself has a better resistance to higher temperatures than PLA filament and although it does have good strength properties it is as yet a totally untested part in the environment you're putting it in.

 

Just airing more on the side of caution with the part itself being passed the filtration area for the engine meaning that if any break down of the part did happen, no matter how minor it would without doubt be sucked into the engine so anyone intending to fit these would need to be well aware of the "possible" risk they may be taking.

 

 

Also with regards to selling these on the forum cs2000 you would need to get in contact with glrnet (Graham) in order to re-open your trader status/account.

Good points Graham, 3d printing is odd.

 

Take PLA, it melts at around 160, yet starts to deform around 45c, admittedly its made of plants and natural stuff but its odd.

 

ABS is what most, if not all, of the under engine bay engine components are made of (well, the ones you can see anyway, it can handle fluids through it as long as theyre below 90c) and they don't melt. The airbox should benefit from having a flow of air too, so it should be absolutely fine. The deform point of ABS is about 90c which would probably melt the air box itself Bumpers are made of ABS too

 

I don't have a factory airbox, but plan to put this in my car, close to the engine (closer than it would be normally) to test this before offering it out.

 

Agreed that any parts that DO come loose will end up in the engine, but this shouldn't happen, I will fully test this before, and obviously Lewis is road testing this too.

 

Don't worry, I know id need to re-instate my trader status, will do that before offering anything.

Edited September 21, 2016 by cs2000

[GMballistic]

I'm well aware cs that ABS is used in a lot of manufacturing components but most of these have had some R&D put into them as well as using ABS specifically used in these environments before. Lots of variants chemically in what actually makes up ABS.

 

As you would be offering these parts to others who then would put them in their cars it is only fair to point out a possible risk that may occur should the part fail especially as it is essentially untested. I say essentially untested because ideally you'd want a product before going on the market to be tested for a good length of time being exposed to as many as, if not all variants in temperature range & conditions.

 

I work in additive manufacturing currently as a Rapid Prototyping Technician so I use 3D printers on a daily basis although we use Projet & SLA machines which are a lot more high end than these extruding filament 3D printers.

The parts though even we create are for the most part intended as prototype parts for proof of concept/design, pieces of artwork, trial fitment parts, medical or for use in creating silicone tools which would then be used to create small run batch production parts using various types of resins.

 

Anyway I've said my piece and you know what you need to do if you do decide to go ahead with any type of batch manufacture.

[HaydnH]

I understand you are planning on using ABS filament which in itself has a better resistance to higher temperatures than PLA filament and although it does have good strength properties it is as yet a totally untested part in the environment you're putting it in.

 

What's the worst case scenario though? The stack shatters/breaks and the air filter catches the crap? I doubt the air velocity would be great enough to cut right through the filter and enter the engine, you'd have to expect the odd stone or whatever hitting the filter which would cause more damage.

[davey_83]

the stack is post filter..............

[HaydnH]

the stack is post filter..............

 

Ah...

[cs2000]

End of the day, Lewis is already running one on his car, I won't offer these out unless I'm confident in their strength to the point where I'd run one on my car if I had the stock air box.

 

Like with any mod, there's the potential for issue, but people don't worry when they install a £10 pod filter from eBay that it's going to break up and enter their engine, or that actually it's useless at filtering, it's the choice we all make.

 

As I said, Lewis is running his and il be testing my prints as much as possible, after that the choice is yours to make.

 

GM, must be interesting working in that industry!

[GMballistic]

GM, must be interesting working in that industry!

It's extremely satisfying and yes very interesting as every day is different.

 

Been at it almost 5 years now with the company I'm with but maybe changing soon, ..hoping to stay within the industry though as additive manufacture, albeit a fairly old concept now is still at the forefront of manufacturing.

[cs2000]

GM, must be interesting working in that industry!

It's extremely satisfying and yes very interesting as every day is different.

 

Been at it almost 5 years now with the company I'm with but maybe changing soon, ..hoping to stay within the industry though as additive manufacture, albeit a fairly old concept now is still at the forefront of manufacturing.

I still feel this technology is a growing front though, theres always new and more capable machines and new techniques and materials becoming available !

 

Right, I'm back from my days away with work, going to work on getting a 100% perfect priunt this weekend.

 

My plan for testing? Well, day to day I drive my work van, its a 2016 Mercedes Citan, 1.9 (I think) diesel. As its a turbo, it gets quite toasty under the engine bay. I'm going to zip tie one somewhere close to the engine block itself to check for heat, then zip tie one to the front grille, this should test its resistance to wind, rain, dirt, stones etc.

 

Ive done 5,500 miles in 3 months in that thing, so I reckon a few weeks of testing in these rather extreme circumstances should show up any flaws, if all is good I will proceed from there.

 

EDIT: Got some new slicing software at the weekend and LewisUK has also kindly made a slight modification to the thickness of the part, the prints I'm getting are now a lot stronger and I'm having a lot less aborted print jobs (as in, 0 so far).

 

AS promised ive stuck two on my van, it has 2 velocity stacks fitted, that's worth 30BHP surely! One outside to get wet and dirty, one inside to get hot, and we will see how this ABS material does. Done 250 miles today, all still fine, no signs of warping on either part or delamination of layers.

 

 

 

The van is a turbo so there's plenty of heat in the engine bay. On a similar note. Ive decided against acetone polishing, I have been reading that the results are good, but it overall weakens the entire part, so each one will be hand finished. As long as the inside surface of the cone thing is smooth, it will perform just the same.

 

Edited September 26, 2016 by cs2000

[cs2000]

SO just to update you all on this. The modified design Lewis made has worked wonders.

 

The two samples sat on those two places on the van for 2 weeks, the first week they covered 966 miles with me all across the country, the second week I was on holiday getting some sun, so they were idle, but they were exposed to the outside weather. The last thing I'm doing is il be sticking one in the freezer and one in a bowl of wate3r for a week each, so if next Friday all is well, il pay my fees and get these up for sale as I think that's proven durability, I'm deliberately being way harder on them than they would ever see in real life!

[coldel]

Great initiative to try and use this tech, but without being an expert (and flame me if this sounds daft) would this part not be something that effectively has to survive the lifetime of the engine? If you effectively glue it in place, its there to stay, or would you consider replacing it each year for instance? Is 1000 miles and a week in the freezer going to replicate 100,000 miles and many thousands of temperature changes over its lifetime to be confident to say its good to go? Just a thought...

[cs2000]

Great initiative to try and use this tech, but without being an expert (and flame me if this sounds daft) would this part not be something that effectively has to survive the lifetime of the engine? If you effectively glue it in place, its there to stay, or would you consider replacing it each year for instance? Is 1000 miles and a week in the freezer going to replicate 100,000 miles and many thousands of temperature changes over its lifetime to be confident to say its good to go? Just a thought...

Not going to flame you, its a valid point, same as what GMballistic brought up.

 

I am reasonably confident the part will last the life of the car. I can only test it so much and I'm being hard on it on purpose to try to make it fail if its going to.

 

At the end of the day, like any other mod, its up to the buyer to decide if its the right fit for their car. Some people will only buy genuine NISMO kit for example, others are happy with the eBay stuff and to hell with the consequences.

 

If you have any thought on how I could test it more thoroughly, id be willing to take them on board, but at this point, id be running it on my car if I didn't already have a intake sorted out.

[blazemaguire]

Had you considered moulding them? I.e 3d print the opposite/negative shape ( a mould).. this you could smooth as strength of the mould is not crucial. Then use a silicone based moulding agent poured in to the cavity. Would be quicker to mass produce then as well if you made the mould in two parts... also, silicone based parts might be more resilient in an engine evironment and wouldn't have layers to de laminate.

[cs2000]

Had you considered moulding them? I.e 3d print the opposite/negative shape ( a mould).. this you could smooth as strength of the mould is not crucial. Then use a silicone based moulding agent poured in to the cavity. Would be quicker to mass produce then as well if you made the mould in two parts... also, silicone based parts might be more resilient in an engine evironment and wouldn't have layers to de laminate.

Good idea and technically will work, but more time than I'm willing to invest in this tbh. The attraction to me was the simplicity aspect of 3d printing the thing.

 

I guess like all things new, people are scared of it...

 

If anyone wants one of these, contact me and il sort out the correct fees to the club etc and you can have one, but a few naysayers is all it takes to put a lot of people off so see no point in going forward with this in the way I had planned, despite it being ran on the OP's car still and working fine. Maybe I can find a part to replicate/improve that people wont be so scared of.