Brexit 23rd June..?

[Jetpilot]

I never said they were evil dude

[coldel]

I never said they were evil dude

 

I know...I just popped that post in there a bit randomly

 

Just watching the sparing between Leave and Stay, somewhat ironically its now the Leave campaign that are leveraging 'Project Fear' - be interesting to see how it all pans out over the next couple of weeks.

[TT350]

I'm finding it difficult.

 

It seems to me every generation of politician just uses and abuses their power and allows the rape of the country to suit their own ends. No actual interest in anything beyond that.

 

Old wobbly chops who's in power now, I particularly dislike. He really does sh1t on the little guy and blow the todger of the big boys in the global playground. Spineless.

 

Why can't we get away from Eton, Cambridge and Oxford boys who have NO concept of life outside of that circle? Other than the trips into the ghetto that they no doubt dread.

 

I say this because if we get a 'real' human being who is in touch with the nation as a whole and not just their own little troupe of guffawing snot nosed nasal sounding bumhole for hire to the highest bidder harlots, then we might get some real democracy and actions made with the wellbeing of Britain. Which I can only see the EU stifling. Someone with less interest on his own political and financial gain might be the man for the job.

 

If such a politician exists.

[Jetpilot]

What is needed is a business man/woman to run the country, problem is, no one would like it because until we were in the black, we would all be f*******

[coldel]

Its because most people who get qualified through very good universities go off and get £1m jobs with big corporations (and invariably make similar decisions on people as politicians do - how many bankers, CEOs etc get good press nowadays?).

 

Plenty of decisions are made by politicians that benefit Britain, they are not going to kill the country off for the sake of it, it's their 'business' after all they are running, the press though will only report the things that go wrong.

 

The issue is that they have to toe the party line, when they go against the whip, they will find themselves with the sack. How many people you know would risk being fired to 'voice an opinion'?

[Ekona]

That's what's happening now

[glrnet]

Every month we get a free local publication called Vantage Point, it plopped onto the door mat today and had this article wriiten by Dan Hadden who is an MEP, whether he has a hidden agenda I know not. Make your own minds up

 

[rtbiscuit]

interesting read, would like to see the other side of the argument when they publish that as a counter balance

[glrnet]

One moment sir!! I meant to do that and was distracted

[glrnet]

Here you go

 

[Ekona]

The control of borders stuff is nonsense in that article, from both sides.

[rtbiscuit]

the security and border control stuff I tend to ignore on both sides; I honestly don't think its the main issue.

[gsexr]

7 reasons to leave and three to stay in... nuff said

[rtbiscuit]

7 reasons to leave and three to stay in... nuff said

 

I would say the out side is better written than the in; especially for a simple mind like mine with a short atten.......

[coldel]

I have seen some odd numbers banded around on payments, from £30bn+ to something like the above. The crazy thing is that the Treasury publicly publishes the figure and net spend was for 2015 £8.5bn. The gross number is almost irelevant because as I understand it the rebate comes off before payment, so we never actually pay the gross figure. Somewhat ironically we talk about how well we have done and we are the fifth largest economy, but we have achieved that in Europe, thats a real mixed bag and to be honest I wouldnt have raised it as an Out campaigner.

 

The 'shrinking economy' thing about 'shrinking' from 30 to 17 percent is if you take it at face value terrible, but just look at actual numbers and the EU has grown significantly since then, its just the rise of tiger economies in the 90s and BRIC more recently that have shifted the %s but it doesn't mean that the EU is shrinking, the language there is really poor.

 

Law is a really hard one, I am no law expert but from what I understand you have UK legislation which has hardly any EU influence, and EU regulations that often pass through in trade - UK legislation has an EU impact of something like 10%, and even then thats just us literally showing them and saying 'we are doing this' and thats it. The regulation is what counts as thats something like 50% of trade regulation being dictated by the EU rolling this out to all member states. I read all this a few months back so can't remember the details, but interesting that the Out campaign do not actually mention that we already have the majority of legislation under our control, we are not 'taking that back' by any means because we already own it.

 

I think the stronger leadership point in the In page is a bit weak, again somewhat ironically, it doesnt qualify any of the statements at all. If we 'have a seat' at the table I would want to know what exactly we have been doing over the last 10 years with that seat, why has it benefited us, give us examples?

 

Trying not to sound like a bloody minded Stay campaigner but some of the numbers in that sheet and language used is enough to convince most people, but the facts behind it are quite different.

[The G Man]

What is needed is a business man/woman to run the country, problem is, no one would like it because until we were in the black, we would all be f*******

 

We need a Donald Trump

 

Well, some well considered arguments in this discussion, mostly by the 'in' crowd. But the voting in the poll would suggest that the 'UKIPers' amongst us would win the argument if that was replicated nationwide. However, my thought on that is that as a car community, it is almost inconceivable that our swing wouldn't be right of centre.

 

Hopefully, the electorate of the south, will see more sense and vote 'in'. It's probably the only thing that's going to stop the Tories from continuing to rob pension funds, be that state or occupational.

 

Secretly, well not a secret anymore , I hope the UKIP trend continues in the south, just the tipping point to create the wake up needed to constitute a radical UK rethink (waits for the anti Scottish Nationalist flaming, subsidy junky nonsense )

 

Whatever happens, the idea that the UK will return to a 'jumpers for goalposts' society will never happen.

[Jetpilot]

Any old chance to have a dig at the awful tories/Dave , how quickly people forget just what a wonderful position Labour left this country in and as for the mighty snp, with their huge 1.4 million votes only a couple of football match attendances more than the green party and imagine our lives as motorists if they had as many seats as snp.

 

You had your chance to go independent and bottled it, lets hope the UK doesnt

[grahamc]

What is needed is a business man/woman to run the country, problem is, no one would like it because until we were in the black, we would all be f*******

 

We need a Donald Trump

 

Mr Sugar?

[-Bradders-]

[Stutopia]

I'd buy into that argument if I believed savings will go on the NHS (amongst other things) rather than a cut in corporation tax.

 

Also, politicians in Brussels are elected. That's just a flat out lie.

[Ekona]

Propaganda at it's finest.

 

Safer: Safer for who? Utter bobbins. Change is dangerous, in anything.

Unelected politicians: They're all elected. Not all by the UK, but they're all elected.

£350M a week on the NHS: No chance. Let's pretend the figures are correct, and we actually end up with that surplus per week. All that will happen is that the money would go into reducing the national debt, to balance the books. The NHS won't see a penny extra.

 

It's this kind of nonsense that's stopping a genuine debate on the subject. Personally, I'd rather just see Col up there sorting out the wheat from the chaff, on the entire internet he's the only person I've seen actually break the arguments down on both sides.

[-Bradders-]

But its true, the internet said so

[-Bradders-]

anyone noticed how the closer we've got, the less coverage of the migrant crisis there is? I don't see anything on the news anymore about calais etc.. daily mail has stuck all the isis terrorist @*!# at the bottom of its pages, the news seems to have changed.

[grahamc]

Propaganda at it's finest.

 

Safer: Safer for who? Utter bobbins. Change is dangerous, in anything.

Unelected politicians: They're all elected. Not all by the UK, but they're all elected.

£350M a week on the NHS: No chance. Let's pretend the figures are correct, and we actually end up with that surplus per week. All that will happen is that the money would go into reducing the national debt, to balance the books. The NHS won't see a penny extra.

 

It's this kind of nonsense that's stopping a genuine debate on the subject. Personally, I'd rather just see Col up there sorting out the wheat from the chaff, on the entire internet he's the only person I've seen actually break the arguments down on both sides.

 

And reducing the national debt isnt a good thing?

 

Im not saying that I agree or disagree.....

[grahamc]

anyone noticed how the closer we've got, the less coverage of the migrant crisis there is? I don't see anything on the news anymore about calais etc.. daily mail has stuck all the isis terrorist @*!# at the bottom of its pages, the news seems to have changed.

 

I drove through Calais on Monday, didnt see any migrants

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Admittedly, I was in the GTR and doing 180mph