Ekona Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 That I'm less convinced on, tbh. He doesn't strike me as the kind of man who takes sage advice on board! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetSet Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 America has always been a fairly open racist society, I can remember as a teenager when the deep South still had segregation, not much better than South Africa. If Trump is elected I would expect some really serious problems to emerge....oh and we really need a thread on The American Election, it's incredibly important for us who gets elected, a loose cannon like Trump or a safe pair of hands like Clinton. Pete 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyZ Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 "Arianna Huffington is unattractive, both inside and out. I fully understand why her former husband left her for a man - he made a good decision." -- Donald Trump. This is sexism, and just plain rude. It's true though. Also I don't think it's sexist at all, it's just a personal insult which either makes you despise the man for poor taste or love him for speaking his mind. We've all said things about other people we don't like that may well be in poor taste, but because we keep it between our friends then it's deemed okay. Because he says it out loud, suddenly it's incredibly offensive? Are we as two-faced as we deem him to be? I don't know. I know I'm coming over as a Trump-apologiser, and I really don't mean to be as I think he'd be an utterly dreadful world leader. I just find the situation fascinating. He's just an excellent public speaker who knows exactly who he's aiming at, and how to get results. That's pretty much it. Some of what he says is a joke that people take out of context ("It's freezing and snowing in New York - we need global warming!"), some of it is just being (maybe a bit too) frank and honest in public, and then some of it is, yes, controversial at best. As an aside, and as this thread has obviously gone off topic already, the term sexism gets grossly misused these days, thanks largely I believe to a misguided social media-based 'feminism' campaign. Insulting a woman isn't sexist in itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docwra Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 "Arianna Huffington is unattractive, both inside and out. I fully understand why her former husband left her for a man - he made a good decision." -- Donald Trump. This is sexism, and just plain rude. It's true though. OK, great - what about his plan not to allow any Muslims (one would assume this includes doctors and US military) into the US? Or suggesting that all Mexicans are drug using thieves? Running up a personal debt of $900m and continuing to effectively steal money from investors? The guy and his beliefs are abhorrent in a modern world and Im struggling to believe someone as switched on as you cant see it. If he was a TV personality or a sportstar then great, but to suggest this is the right man to lead the Western world is messed up. As for being sexist, its p[retty clear to me that women are just objects as far as he is concerned, if that isnt sexist I dont know what is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 Like I said, I don't agree with much of what he says. I can see why it's popular, though. It's the inevitable backlash of the modern day PC world, and now we've gone from the extreme where we can't raise the St George cross on St George's Day* to where it's okay to say that all Muslims are evil and need banning. People are like children: Tell them not to do something (i.e. vote Trump) and they're more likely to do it, just to spite people. For absolute clarity, I think the guy would make a terrible president and neither would I like to go drinking with him, as I think his views are wholly out of touch with a progressive modern society. However, I can also understand why some are voting for him in their droves. *I know it's a complete myth, but it's an easy example. Apologies for the laziness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stutopia Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 So what you're saying Dan is, not only do you love the smell of Trump but you also can't fly a George Cross these days? You drive a cab in your spare time by any chance? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DCo-A2rAjmM&sns=em 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetSet Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 I can also understand why some are voting for him in their droves. I don't fully understand the primaries as each different state has its own rules but I'm thinking that we have a situation not a million miles away from the election of Jeremy Corbin. I've read that Democrats have been voting for him in large numbers at the primaries (in those states that have open primaries) because they think he's the candidate that Hillary Clinton will easily defeat. Much in the way that many non Labour supporters paid their three quid in order to vote for Jeremy Corbin as they saw him as unelectable . Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 So what you're saying Dan is, not only do you love the smell of Trump but you also can't fly a George Cross these days? You drive a cab in your spare time by any chance? I DO NOT LIKE DONALD F***ING TRUMP 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldel Posted March 16, 2016 Author Share Posted March 16, 2016 So when do we think all the big flags and national coverage will properly start for the referendum, all pretty low key at the moment and its not that far off... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetSet Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 So when do we think all the big flags and national coverage will properly start for the referendum, all pretty low key at the moment and its not that far off... At the moment its all about The Welsh Assembly election in May so I suppose once we have that out of the way it'll take off for us probably. Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plebpl Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 Considering I currently work in the Netherlands and will almost certainly be made redundant should we leave I am for staying. I know of 300 people in my organisation who have all trained in international relations. All of us would be made redundant and any experience we have gained in relation to EU relations will become obsolete meaning I will not be able to find work. There are impacts beyond the obvious that some people do not realise. Leaving the EU for some people will ruin there lives as they know it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irn Bru Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 Considering I currently work in the Netherlands and will almost certainly be made redundant should we leave I am for staying. I know of 300 people in my organisation who have all trained in international relations. All of us would be made redundant and any experience we have gained in relation to EU relations will become obsolete meaning I will not be able to find work. There are impacts beyond the obvious that some people do not realise. Leaving the EU for some people will ruin there lives as they know it. agreed, but what about the 1000's of jobs already lost to immigrants, and the 1000's of uk nationals that cant get a house, doc's appointment, wages being driven down especially in the construction industry and farming etc etc etc because of all the migrants coming to the UK and god help us if the Turks get a free ride to the UK. Our health and welfare systems are drowning in overload from these people and the infrastructure isn't in place to cope. My daughter is a nurse and she tells me insane stories of her working day, like the nhs having to supply hundreds of interpreters because they cant speak a sentence of english !!!!!!!!!!! Cant see how suddenly all the UK nationals working abroad will be made redundant, they will just need a working visa or have to apply to immigrate to the country they are working in. I'm not against immigration, as long as its not a free for all. How the hell is Europe's rich (of which there is only a few) countries supposed to employ and house all these people and more important, how / whos paying for it.........ummm let me guess.... yes the UK tax payer gets shafted again :-(. All this political crap about immigrants putting more into the pot than they take out............yeah right, just political spin. When the poles first started coming over it was for sure, working Poles, with a decent attitude to UK life, now its all the lazy gits coming over Bulgaria and Rumania for free this and free that. Personally I'm sick to the teeth of paying for them and their families, whilst I have to watch my community go down the pan because there's no money left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian@TORQEN Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 (edited) Brian, I shouldn't get involved, but can't just stand and watch while you throw random stuff at "Rumania" while being Romanian Do you care to share some stats and details about the "lazy Romanians gits" getting "free this and free that" on which your affirmation is based on? I'd love yo have a read on. Last time I've checked, there were last than 2000 Romanian citizens in 2015 that claim housing benefit in UK. Meanwhile over 6000 Romanians were recruited back home by British recruitment agency to come work for NHS in UK. Over 7000 Romanian students, researchers and teachers are studying, researching or teaching in UK universities. I personally know hundreds of very hard working Romanians in different industries from labourers and car wash staff to famous chefs, finance City boys, musicians, business owners, artists and actors to CEO of Canary Wharf and so on. There's much more to be added to this, but let's not let ourselves led by Daily Fail and The Sun... Edited March 22, 2016 by Adrian@TORQEN 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stutopia Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 Considering I currently work in the Netherlands and will almost certainly be made redundant should we leave I am for staying. I know of 300 people in my organisation who have all trained in international relations. All of us would be made redundant and any experience we have gained in relation to EU relations will become obsolete meaning I will not be able to find work. There are impacts beyond the obvious that some people do not realise. Leaving the EU for some people will ruin there lives as they know it. agreed, but what about the 1000's of jobs already lost to immigrants, and the 1000's of uk nationals that cant get a house, doc's appointment, wages being driven down especially in the construction industry and farming etc etc etc because of all the migrants coming to the UK and god help us if the Turks get a free ride to the UK. Our health and welfare systems are drowning in overload from these people and the infrastructure isn't in place to cope. My daughter is a nurse and she tells me insane stories of her working day, like the nhs having to supply hundreds of interpreters because they cant speak a sentence of english !!!!!!!!!!! Cant see how suddenly all the UK nationals working abroad will be made redundant, they will just need a working visa or have to apply to immigrate to the country they are working in. I'm not against immigration, as long as its not a free for all. How the hell is Europe's rich (of which there is only a few) countries supposed to employ and house all these people and more important, how / whos paying for it.........ummm let me guess.... yes the UK tax payer gets shafted again :-(. All this political crap about immigrants putting more into the pot than they take out............yeah right, just political spin. When the poles first started coming over it was for sure, working Poles, with a decent attitude to UK life, now its all the lazy gits coming over Bulgaria and Rumania for free this and free that. Personally I'm sick to the teeth of paying for them and their families, whilst I have to watch my community go down the pan because there's no money left. So what you're saying is that the economic "crap" about migrants generating more than they cost is just "political spin" but the anecdotal "lazy gits coming over Bulgaria and Rumania" is evidence based fact? And the people who "cant speak a sentence of english" are: 1 - not only taking the jobs 2 - but then not paying any tax in these jobs they've taken 3 - and also not spending any of the money they earn from these tax free jobs in the economy 4 - then after the tax free job, where they don't spend any earnings, they then get "free this and that" (whatever that even is?). Which is it? It can't be all of them as they are directly contradictory! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plebpl Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 I am unable to go into the details of my role but I work for a eu organisation. As part of working there a requirement is citizenship in a eu member state. So no I will not just be able to apply for a work visa and carry on. You seem to think that any Uk citizens working abroad will be allowed to stay working whereas any Eu citizens working in the Uk will have to leave. What makes us so special to expect that? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plebpl Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 Oh and my dad works in construction and is currently earning more than he ever has, he has seen no signs of skilled workers wages being lowered to accommodate eu citizens working on site Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetSet Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 I live in an area that has a high level of EU migrants mainly from Poland and Romania but many other Eastern European countries too. It's interesting that there are relatively few Commonwealth immigrants or British born Asians or Africans around here , ie North East Wales. Poles in particular are highly prized in the agricultural and food industries, they turn up for work on time and are regarded as good workers. The quarry near to us employs a dozen or so Romanians who live on site in mobile homes and the boss of the quarry tells me he's very happy with them. I've spoken to quite a number of the Romanians, they speak decent English and one guy who came to The U.K just 4 years ago with no English at all told me he learnt English from watching the TV and is now able to read fluently in English. Same goes for The Poles and The Hungarians I've met, their English is good and one of the guys local to me and on this forum has a Lithuanian G/F who speaks perfect English. The message is always the same, they come over here to have better lives much in the same way that the Scots, Welsh, Irish and English moved to Canada, Australia, New Zealand and The U.S (and still do) for a better life. I see nothing wrong in that. Of course, nothing's perfect and there are a few who exploit the system but then again there's plenty of British born people who do that. As far as economics go, they spend money, pay taxes, setup businesses and integrate well into British society. Another thing is that you rarely see any Eastern Europeans over the age of 45, they tend just to bring their wives and children with them. They are not disconnected with British society, unlike some commonwealth immigrants and most of them don't want to go back. There are issues with housing, schooling in some parts of the country but not around here, in fact, some schools would have been closed as pupil numbers had been falling until the Eastern Europeans arrived. They've also given a huge boost to church attendances in this area. One of the problems we face as a country is always putting the blame onto someone else, it's always someone else's fault. When the first immigrants arrived in numbers there were 2 arguments that the "someone else's fault brigade" put forward, "They're stealing our jobs" and "They're lazy and won't work", says it all really. Pete 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irn Bru Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 Considering I currently work in the Netherlands and will almost certainly be made redundant should we leave I am for staying. I know of 300 people in my organisation who have all trained in international relations. All of us would be made redundant and any experience we have gained in relation to EU relations will become obsolete meaning I will not be able to find work. There are impacts beyond the obvious that some people do not realise. Leaving the EU for some people will ruin there lives as they know it. agreed, but what about the 1000's of jobs already lost to immigrants, and the 1000's of uk nationals that cant get a house, doc's appointment, wages being driven down especially in the construction industry and farming etc etc etc because of all the migrants coming to the UK and god help us if the Turks get a free ride to the UK. Our health and welfare systems are drowning in overload from these people and the infrastructure isn't in place to cope. My daughter is a nurse and she tells me insane stories of her working day, like the nhs having to supply hundreds of interpreters because they cant speak a sentence of english !!!!!!!!!!! Cant see how suddenly all the UK nationals working abroad will be made redundant, they will just need a working visa or have to apply to immigrate to the country they are working in. I'm not against immigration, as long as its not a free for all. How the hell is Europe's rich (of which there is only a few) countries supposed to employ and house all these people and more important, how / whos paying for it.........ummm let me guess.... yes the UK tax payer gets shafted again :-(. All this political crap about immigrants putting more into the pot than they take out............yeah right, just political spin. When the poles first started coming over it was for sure, working Poles, with a decent attitude to UK life, now its all the lazy gits coming over Bulgaria and Rumania for free this and free that. Personally I'm sick to the teeth of paying for them and their families, whilst I have to watch my community go down the pan because there's no money left. So what you're saying is that the economic "crap" about migrants generating more than they cost is just "political spin" but the anecdotal "lazy gits coming over Bulgaria and Rumania" is evidence based fact? And the people who "cant speak a sentence of english" are: 1 - not only taking the jobs 2 - but then not paying any tax in these jobs they've taken 3 - and also not spending any of the money they earn from these tax free jobs in the economy 4 - then after the tax free job, where they don't spend any earnings, they then get "free this and that" (whatever that even is?). Which is it? It can't be all of them as they are directly contradictory! The problem is they are deliberately coming not to work and get everything free when never earned the right, areas where I live not so far from are full of them, don't pay into the system take all benefits and work on the black economy, THAT is my experience of the majority of them in the area I am talking about. Crime has risen and all the local born and bred people have moved out and the place is a @*!# hole now ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irn Bru Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 I am unable to go into the details of my role but I work for a eu organisation. As part of working there a requirement is citizenship in a eu member state. So no I will not just be able to apply for a work visa and carry on. You seem to think that any Uk citizens working abroad will be allowed to stay working whereas any Eu citizens working in the Uk will have to leave. What makes us so special to expect that? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Like most migrants to countries where the skills are needed, and free movement is not an option, you have a required skill set, why else did you get the job you've got ! The other way to look at this situation is this.....The countries they are leaving, if the rate of migration to the key EU countries continues, will only leave huge issues in their home country, how is that a good thing for the poorer EU country ?. Think 25 years down the line, everybody in Europe all crammed into the rich western countries !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irn Bru Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 Oh and my dad works in construction and is currently earning more than he ever has, he has seen no signs of skilled workers wages being lowered to accommodate eu citizens working on site Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Working in construction, in what city ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irn Bru Posted March 22, 2016 Share Posted March 22, 2016 I have run my own commercial landscaping firm for over 15 years now, in edinburgh and I have seen a big drop in what people are prepared to pay now compared to back in the early 00's, and I know the reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irn Bru Posted March 23, 2016 Share Posted March 23, 2016 Brian, I shouldn't get involved, but can't just stand and watch while you throw random stuff at "Rumania" while being Romanian Do you care to share some stats and details about the "lazy Romanians gits" getting "free this and free that" on which your affirmation is based on? I'd love yo have a read on. Last time I've checked, there were last than 2000 Romanian citizens in 2015 that claim housing benefit in UK. Meanwhile over 6000 Romanians were recruited back home by British recruitment agency to come work for NHS in UK. Over 7000 Romanian students, researchers and teachers are studying, researching or teaching in UK universities. I personally know hundreds of very hard working Romanians in different industries from labourers and car wash staff to famous chefs, finance City boys, musicians, business owners, artists and actors to CEO of Canary Wharf and so on. There's much more to be added to this, but let's not let ourselves led by Daily Fail and The Sun... Nothing personal Adrian, just my experience in areas where I live, nowt to do with the Daily Fail or the sun, just my experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plebpl Posted March 23, 2016 Share Posted March 23, 2016 Oh and my dad works in construction and is currently earning more than he ever has, he has seen no signs of skilled workers wages being lowered to accommodate eu citizens working on site Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Working in construction, in what city ? He works in the South around the Portsmouth Southampton areas, he is a chippy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetpilot Posted March 23, 2016 Share Posted March 23, 2016 Immigration is a very real problem imho, the issue here though is two very different spectrums. The ones who want to come and work and the ones who want to come and get hand outs, iron brus comments are as valid as torqens, but there sure as hell needs to be a reform, sadly I am not sure the government (this or the next) has the ability or balls to sort it, whether we are in or out of the Eu. My mum has a saying, its too late locking the gate after the horse has bolted. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sargara Posted March 23, 2016 Share Posted March 23, 2016 So what does everyone think about the terror attacks in Brussels yesterday? I know its not a direct link to the EU referendum but I cant help but feel we (Europe) are all reaping the consiquences of Germanys open door immigration policy. Once the migrants are in Europe it seems almost impossible to control their movement to a single country and not to mention the obvious difficulties in establishing who is actually coming with all the fraud and people smuggling. And the only solution presented seems to be cozying up to Turkey who would otherwise potentially not qualify for membership. Madness. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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