Brexit 23rd June..?

[Bockaaarck]

Or a nice AMG Merc

[HaydnH]

Or an Opel.

[coldel]

with regards to the xenaphobia and racisim, its always been there, I deal as a teacher and have done over the last 13 years issues with anti sematism, anti black and anti asian issues. it is infrequent and i have seen it over 4 schools and all are graded outstanding. there has always been unpleasant undertones in our society, but they are the minority and will go back under their rocks once this has settled.

 

I guess though the result gave closet 'ism's permission to be more vocal about it as if they have been proven 'correct'.

[Ricey]

Turns out the woman who was abused it a bit bonkers and the guy who abused her is equally as bonkers.

 

He's been done for it before. Local nutter who used to work for the chester chronicle.

 

Linky to his previous crimes

 

http://www.chesterchronicle.co.uk/news/chester-cheshire-news/upton-man-hurled-racist-abuse-11120724

 

Not saying it isn't happening because we all know it is but there is going to be a million and one blown out of all proportion stories now.

 

I know the area this woman lives in........categorically there is no way she's received a systemic programme of abuse from the locale......it's right middle England country.

 

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

 

 

[coldel]

There will be nutters, but it is genuinely happening - 57% increase in race related crime in a week is not a normal peak and trough behaviour.

The girl who works at my place is not a nutter and I have no reason not to believe her.

It is a minority, but it is on the increase, it should calm down though - I can only imagine how bad its going to be if its announced officially that immigration will still happen in a few years time when rubber stamping the deals

[JetSet]

with regards to the xenaphobia and racisim, its always been there, I deal as a teacher and have done over the last 13 years issues with anti sematism, anti black and anti asian issues. it is infrequent and i have seen it over 4 schools and all are graded outstanding. there has always been unpleasant undertones in our society, but they are the minority and will go back under their rocks once this has settled.

 

There certainly was a racist element to the campaign but the vast majority was a few notches down from that. When I was in primary school aged about 10 I once called a lad in our class out by the "N" word. I got the cane for that, taught me a lesson in more ways than one. I can still remember the guys name and the incident quite clearly even after 55 years. I came from Merseyside which in the 50's and 60's had a sizeable number of ethnic minorities compared to most of the country and it was fairly normal for children to call foreigners with an offensive name. You know, we all have our prejudices, there is a certain section of our society that I despise and I know that the vast majority don't like this group and also seeing a woman in a full Burka is really spooky (although it's something I've never seen around here). Racism and hate crime will never go away it's just human nature and I think that it's been hyped up by the press to a large extent. It's nowhere near as bad here as say in Russia or The U.S.

 

Pete

Edited June 29, 2016 by JetSet

[HaydnH]

There will be nutters, but it is genuinely happening - 57% increase in race related crime in a week is not a normal peak and trough behaviour.

 

A British Indian guy I know from the local pub was saying that in all his time in the UK he's never suffered racial abuse, until last weekend when he and his children were shouted at and told to "go home" so it's definitely happening. At least the lads from the tram have been arrested pretty quickly so that should act a deterrent. Personally if I was the PM I'd be making an announcement along the lines of "the UK is a tolerant country but we will not tolerate such racist behavior, the police and justice system have been told to show no leniency towards any race hate crimes".

[Juggalo]

Free movement won't happen as part of a free trade deal. Britain holds the aces. The biggest issue in the EU is immigration, immigration followed by immigration.. So we kind of have the EU against the wall.

In two years the pressure from the EU citizens, with the general elections coming up will be even greater to cap the immigration and freemovement.

We'll come out of this with a free trade deal, no free movement. And hopefully most of the anti-democratic protesters will have buggered off to Sweden, rather than trying to force the majority to live their dream.

[marzman]

This is actually really good...

 

[Ekona]

Free movement won't happen as part of a free trade deal. Britain holds the aces. The biggest issue in the EU is immigration, immigration followed by immigration.. So we kind of have the EU against the wall.

In two years the pressure from the EU citizens, with the general elections coming up will be even greater to cap the immigration and freemovement.

We'll come out of this with a free trade deal, no free movement. And hopefully most of the anti-democratic protesters will have buggered off to Sweden, rather than trying to force the majority to live their dream.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-36659900

 

They're right. You don't get to pick and choose what bits you want, you get everything or nothing. That's why this whole thing was doomed from the start. Maybe we can do a deal that gives us access to the market but doesn't involve free movement, but you can bet your arse it will come at a potentially huge financial cost.

[Jetpilot]

I feel this could be a poignant place for my last post on the subject, perhaps very naively imho this is the single biggest problem with the eu and a decisive factor for me voting out, obviously apart from being racist/xenophobic If we want to trade with Germany, France etc etc our negotiations should be between Germany, France etc, not Mr Juncker and or Brussels, i see them as having equally as much to loose as the UK, so is it not within their interests to want to trade, what does Mr Juncker have to gain from counties trade deals apart from a job.

 

If this superstate is to be believed and seeing as everyone suddenly seems to want to quote the media and social media as truth now it suits them, lets assume this is the plan, i am even more glad we are "hopefully" on our way out at that point. A friend told me before the vote the eu were planning to introduce a no leave policy, i.e only the eu could decide if you could go but i couldnt find any reference to it so thought it best not to put it out there to get shot down, however will all the what ifs and about out future, i will put it out there and with the mutterings from the eu about wanting us to trigger article 50 quickly you can be dam sure there is more behind that so maybe this is plan.

 

Be back to this thread in a few months to hopefully talk about some facts on our future.

Edited June 29, 2016 by Jetpilot

[gsexr]

Not too sure how correct this is as lots of people only tell you half a story to suit their means but a fella on the radio said that whilst Norway accepts freedom of movement to have a trade deal it does not have to give those people anything else. eg equal pay/benefits that Norway people get.

I guess this would mean that people would only go there if they had a job to go to and leave if they lost it as they would not get anything else.

His point was the Norway system is not as bad as people make out.

 

As i said though its hard to get real facts from either side.

As an example

The Labour party would like us to believe that all workers rights are protected by the EU but no one has asked them what the junior Doctors are moaning about then. Surely they could just sign the max 48hr agreement that the EU provides and stick two fingers up to J Hunt.

I guess the junior Doctors dont want to do this as they need to do the extra hours to train to become a consultant.

 

So a classic case of neither side telling us the real truth.

 

They all have their own agenda and the EU/Brexit sham is a classic example.

 

As far as i`m concerned Dave offered the referendum so he should have sat back, let the vote take place and then sorted it out but he was so convinced his advisers had got it right and the vote would be remain that he campaigned for that side that its cost him a career. What a donut

 

I still feel the main reason for most people who chose to vote leave was because they wanted to stick two fingers up to Brussels for all its meddling and to make our government responsible for what happens in this country.

A point was made on the TV by a politician from the remain camp that too many things that happen are blamed on Brussels as its the convenient thing to do and people have now reacted to that when given the chance.

 

We need to sort out trade deals with other parts of the world first and when thats done then deal with Europe.

 

As i said in the beginning Dave should sort it out because he started it.

[Ebized]

This is actually really good...

 

 

Bloody nicked the idea from Husky's version of the forum

[coldel]

I guess the issue of immigration as far as I could see was people claiming that they were taking jobs, rather than them claiming. As stats show only something like 5% of immigrants claim out of work benefits, the majority are native based people. So you cannot reasonably argue that its benefits that are the driver as far as I can see? Everyone seemed to be quoting the magic 330,000 net immigration number. It seemed to be more about housing the like that people were concerned with, and concentrations of immigrants i.e. Rochdale.

 

The thing that scares me about the Norway approach is as said before, having to abide by rules you have absolutely no say in. You could argue we had little influence prior to exiting, but now we have none, and are likely to have to abide by them. That doesn't feel very progressive towards the chant of 'taking control' personally?

[HaydnH]

How come GBP is up about 1% against pretty much everything today, FTSE100 up 220 points, FTSE250 up 500 points... and yet my Facebook isn't screaming with idiots saying the economy isn't doomed after all?

[coldel]

Because the guys that run the markets are working bloody hard to keep everything afloat, they are implementing lots of fail safes at the moment based on 2008 on keeping the economy working as best it can we shouldnt underestimate that. We were never going to fall into recession immediately, but we are not going to increase the value of the pound as quickly as we lost it either. What will take the strain is when companies like high street grocers who import around half their products find themselves having an extra 5-10% in costs on top because of the exchange rate, which will of course be passed on to you and me. But yes, no hysteria, but don't think by any means we are 'through the worst of it' next year and beyond is going to be a very rough ride.

[HaydnH]

Because the guys that run the markets are working bloody hard

 

If only you knew who I worked for.

[HaydnH]

oh, p.s: it's not the guys that run the markets who decide the value of the indices, it's investor sentiment and today they've got massive hooves, horns and cajones.

[Ekona]

Is it possible that the markets are keeping high because none of them expect Britain to actually leave the EU now?

Edited June 29, 2016 by Ekona

[Adrian@TORQEN]

HaydnH, long gold, short GBP = GTR

[Bockaaarck]

HaydnH, long gold, short GBP = GTR

 

But Adrian, just remember, paper gold and physical GBP is not always what you're after. Sometimes it's the other way around

[Bockaaarck]

oh, p.s: it's not the guys that run the markets who decide the value of the indices, it's investor sentiment and today they've got massive hooves, horns and cajones.

 

Indeed, the guys your talking about can stay solvent for far longer. And that's sometimes what it comes down to, who has the biggest pile of mad loot to floss across the market

[Chesterfield]

To get even a 40k GTR that's going to take a decent sized spreadbet and the ability of cover a decent margin.

 

Though I could point out the irony of bemoaning the downturn in the economy and then placing a short on the very currency that you are bemoaning the losses on

[Adrian@TORQEN]

I didn't place any bets, stopped playing a while ago

 

Short on DOW and S&P would have been awesome

Edited June 29, 2016 by Adrian@TORQEN

[JetSet]

Free movement won't happen as part of a free trade deal. Britain holds the aces. The biggest issue in the EU is immigration, immigration followed by immigration.. So we kind of have the EU against the wall.

In two years the pressure from the EU citizens, with the general elections coming up will be even greater to cap the immigration and freemovement.

We'll come out of this with a free trade deal, no free movement. And hopefully most of the anti-democratic protesters will have buggered off to Sweden, rather than trying to force the majority to live their dream.

 

Britain holds all of the aces , words fail me.

 

Pete