dajw Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 All I can say is: WHOHOOOOOOOOOOO! You know when your car just feels just right? Cold dense air is good for engines, especially for force fed ones! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetpilot Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 (edited) Get yourself water injection then everyday is a foggy day, even when its sunny Or water/meth if you want to go nuts Edited November 3, 2015 by Jetpilot 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floydbax Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 All I can say is: WHOHOOOOOOOOOOO! You know when your car just feels just right? Cold dense air is good for engines, especially for force fed ones! +Wet air OK for N/A too but obvs' not as much a difference Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snjur Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 Water/meth is just good if you don't have any troubles in life so you need a headache to worry about Sent from my SM-G850F using Tapatalk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nissanman312 Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 Water/meth is just good if you don't have any troubles in life so you need a headache to worry about Sent from my SM-G850F using Tapatalk I'll give that a miss then lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snjur Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 (edited) I think there are no bhp gains on experience from my friend. In contrary there where only loses. Which makes sens as there is unused volume due to water and water cannot be compressed or burned. So basically gains with cooling are lost by this volume occupied by water. Also due to much cooler mixture you need to advace ignition timing. In case of any failure of water/meth system failure and with advanced ignition timing set it's a perfect recipe for disaster and blowing engine. As my buddy would say "keep it simple" Sent from my SM-G850F using Tapatalk Edited November 3, 2015 by Snjur 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-Ricky Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 You have obviously never run WI...properly! I would never say its a performance gain on its own, but its certainly a performance enhancer when used correctly. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snjur Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 I really don't see any benefit on petrol engine. Special vq35de. On diesle maybe can be better. I wouldn't say they didn't run properly as people evolved have a long time experience in in SA and mods. Doing car going 8 sec to quater mile and so.Im just passing their thoughts as they had worked it on cars. But for me it a s bigger disaster if something goes wrong than gain Sent from my SM-G850F using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richf Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 I really don't see any benefit on petrol engine. Special vq35de. On diesle maybe can be better. I wouldn't say they didn't run properly as people evolved have a long time experience in in SA and mods. Doing car going 8 sec to quater mile and so.Im just passing their thoughts as they had worked it on cars. But for me it a s bigger disaster if something goes wrong than gain Sent from my SM-G850F using Tapatalk A mate of mine wasnt a fan either , he builds 700hp+ Hayabusa engines for a living and hobby. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-Ricky Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 (edited) I have run WI/meth on several cars, and providing you can map for the benefits its very good, yes you do need some fail safes if you do it correctly, but on any turbo car its a very good way of charge cooling and in cylinder cooling, and can allow timing changes without risk of detonation, but its charge cooling qualities can be an advantage even on a N/A motor. The only time you may get performance problems are if you inject at the wrong quantities and in adequate vaporisation...just like fuel injectors get it wrong and it wont work. Edited November 3, 2015 by Tricky-Ricky 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dajw Posted November 3, 2015 Author Share Posted November 3, 2015 I actually spoke with Jez about water/meth as a way to manage charge temperatures on my Stillen kit. He also advised against for low cost/benefit. The theory makes good sense to me — the latent heat of vaporisation of water and the change in octane rating should in theory only help the situation. I worry about the reliability of the kits, for a start I wouldn't want to run dry or worse, have a steam explosion in a cylinder if it went too far the other way (is this even possible?). My current thought is to install a better closed loop monitoring system next year and a switch to Ecutek (assuming they can support the automatic transmission tuning). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-Ricky Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 WI has no effect on octane fella, if you where to run 100% meth that's a different matter and would need a different map, and anything less than a 50/50/water/meth wont make any odds, you also wont have any problems other than a loss of performance by running too much water/meth. IMO WI is a worthwhile addition if your FI, simply for the charge cooling and det suppression side of things, and adding a basic system is not such a pain, as long as you remember not to try and inject too much water, this is where a lot of people go wrong, and then say oh it messes with performance. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snjur Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 I think much more safer is than to go on E85 Sent from my SM-G850F using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richf Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 I think much more safer is than to go on E85 Sent from my SM-G850F using Tapatalk or a little nos 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetSet Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 Cold dense air is good for engines, especially for force fed ones! I don't know if you'll see any improvement though TBH and in any case cold dense air will increase the drag coefficient. You need to live at altitude, somewhere like Denver or better still Santa Fe really . Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetpilot Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 (edited) Tricky speaks the truth, water/meth is fine, but using the meth part as a enhancer, to further cool the intake temp. Sure you could use more meth and map for it but as dawj says, you then rely on the meth and if you run dry or it fails, your in trouble. Never heard of systems failing and flooding the engine either. If your concerned run a mechanical water injection pre supercharger firing into the blades, its a very effective method of cooling, rather than post supercharger. Edited November 3, 2015 by Jetpilot 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OllyB Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 Tricky speaks the truth, water/meth is fine, but using the meth part as a enhancer, to further cool the intake temp. Sure you could use more meth and map for it but as dawj says, you then rely on the meth and if you run dry or it fails, your in trouble. Never heard of systems failing and flooding the engine either. If your concerned run a mechanical water injection pre supercharger firing into the blades, its a very effective method of cooling, rather than post supercharger. Will firing water at the impella not damage it, water and high speed turbines is a bad mix in my experiance... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetpilot Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 Tricky speaks the truth, water/meth is fine, but using the meth part as a enhancer, to further cool the intake temp. Sure you could use more meth and map for it but as dawj says, you then rely on the meth and if you run dry or it fails, your in trouble. Never heard of systems failing and flooding the engine either. If your concerned run a mechanical water injection pre supercharger firing into the blades, its a very effective method of cooling, rather than post supercharger. Will firing water at the impella not damage it, water and high speed turbines is a bad mix in my experiance... No Its such a fine mist its no real difference to fog. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OllyB Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 I disagree, even as a fog the water droplets will wear the blades on a turbine spinning at thousands of rpm. May be ok for a screw type.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetpilot Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 So it wasnt a question then There is a reason kits are available and have proven success Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OllyB Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 It was a kind of question then I thought about it and concluded that I wouldn't want to do it. I've seen significant damage to turbine blades caused by water but after doing a little bit of reading it seems that it's an accepted method as long as very fine nozzles are used... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetpilot Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 Its been around for years and was developed for ww2 aircraft, i would have absolutely no concerns in using it, your probably talking 100k miles before any significant erosion is noticeable At some point i will be going for it on my v3, imho, it can only help, not for more power, but inlet temps and det, it also cleans the top end of the engine 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OllyB Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 Don't disagree, lots of benifit to reduce charge temps.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OllyB Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 (edited) Oh and I find gunk best for cleaning the top of the engine ... Edited November 3, 2015 by OllyB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nissanman312 Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 (edited) Dose anyone have a link to the sort of kits you would use I've no idea how they work If the kit failed for whatever reason you could have a safe map built like I have. if iat reach a certain temp my car switches to a safe map Litchfield built Edited November 3, 2015 by nissanman312 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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