Rainman

Thanks for all the responses and PM's - all the cars ppl PM'ed me about were spot on but unfortunately were just that little bit too far away or whilst they were in budget I would have need to sell my Leon privately too. I found a car late on Friday and went to see it at lunchtime today and bought it. Details over in the 350Z section shortly. Phil

Actually, thats pretty much spot on and I'd say they're within a few percentage of each other - but that could easily be down to the time of year at which the figures are reviewed. Phil

Well no, not really - the fact is that one is more desireable than the other, and if supply swamps demand then hey presto - it's a buyers market. People might expect to pay a small premium for higher spec, but no one is going to add on the cost of what the option was when new. It's like saying 'my car might have aged 9 years, but my bose stero, etc is still brand new'. Lets be realistic. The GT pack was an extra £2500 when new, not £1500. Hey, those are Mega's figures, not mine. I didn't alude to how much the option costs when new. Agreed. Well whilst the evidence of a non-GT car selling slower is anecdotal it would tend to support what I said previously. I know what ppl believe that premium should be for a GT car, but thats just a personal opinion. Don't blame me I don't make up the market values. I'm only going by the same valuations that everyone else uses, and in fact I'm using the one most likely to give a higher value because it is updated the least. I totally understand why ppl are upset at the resale value of their cars here, but if you were on my side of the fence you wouldn't be wanting to pay more than anyone else either. I'm not trying to devalue ppl's pride and joy, gawd knows I've lost thousands on motors over the years - you are preaching to the choir and I broadly sympathise with you. But going back to keeping this thread on topic - I am after a car, and I AM flexible on price if it's the right car. I'm also still considering the two cars where I've been in touch with ppl on the forums here. The fact is they are lovely examples but it just wouldn't make sense to buy only to butcher them - they're just too nice for that and I wouldn't dream of trying haggle them down any more as it would just be disrepectful. I am sensitive to the fact that forum cars are going to have a great deal of sentiment attached to them, and quite rightly so. Phil

Of course not Actually Rob, I don't feel that no one is taking me seriously as there are a number of very valid and useful comments by the majority of people. The fact is that the derailing of the thread has served to mask the generally friendly nature and also the valid points that many people have already contributed. I can only say that I'm totally guilty in not acknowledging them sooner. In reality there has been more constructive comments made than non-constructive ones and there is just two trolls spoiling the whole thing - not just for me but everyone else. Thankfully I'm not the kind of person to tar everyone with the same brush. I apologies whole heartedly to anyone that I have not responded back to with an acknowledgment of their experience and also the many welcomes posted too - really it has been useful and just marred by post hijackers. Well I have to admit to having no experience in modding a Z, but then I probably wouldn't be here now if I did ... or at least not for the same reasons. As for my Leon, whatever it is capable of I see it for what it is ... a practical front wheel drive family hatchback and something I drive every day. I'm more than aware of what it's capable of if I tinkered with it but I've made a concious to decision to keep it stock .... resale value being one reason and the other being that the untapped potential of the Z *could* be on a completely different scale ... depending on where one ventures with it. I've tried all manner of FWD hatches and the experience of anything more than 200 bhp from a FWD just isn't the same as with RWD. It's not really a valid comparison and there is much more to it than just power-to-weight figures on a piece of paper ... but then you do get people where raw figures are all they care about without thought to how it actually drives once its been fiddled with. Fiddling with my Leon just wouldn't enter my head as to me it's just not the right starting point. It's important to keep things in perspective - it's only a couple of individuals. Everyone else has been perfectly nice. It's also interesting that since I made a post in the 'Wanted' section that one of the aforementioned made an attempt to derail that post too - by asking me if I'd 'considered running costs' and he even went as far as stating that if I was only going to spend 6k then I might not have considered that. I just reported his post and it was removed - but why he thought that someone would even care about running costs on 3.5L petrol car is beyond me and I never mentioned a budget ceiling of 6k for a car and the fact is that I'm very flexible. One can only assume that the post was designed to provoke a reaction, and now I'm posting about it here so I guess he did get what he was after in the end - shame he has nothing better to do than troll tbh, and if thats really all he's capable of then I'd take his advise with a pinch of salt anyway. It really is early doors at the moment. I have a few options open to me and one particular opportunity to do somethnig really special. Because of the inviduals involved I can't really say much more, but it maybe that I just end up spending the whole of my Q1 and Q2 2012 project budget on a nice car simply to own and drive, if only for the looks of the car as I like them enough. Don't worry mate, no offense taken. I look forward to updating everyone with my progress and we'll see where we go. Phil

Well actually they do, and the price difference in the second hand market is around £400 to £500 depending on dealer or private sale. The extra it costs when new isn't reflected in second hand value and that is true of many cars. Essentially, the difference between a fully loaded car and one that isn't is that one sells easier than the other and the buyer will only add a token value to the fully loaded model. There is an argument to made in that people buying second-hand cars probably have more consideration for resale value than people buying new cars - lets face it, no one buys new cars with the hope of getting anything like the purchase price back, unless it's something REALLY special. Phil

Very possibly, and I would expect average mileage for any book price - approx 10k - 12k per annum. So a 53 plate with 90K miles is fine and with what I've got in mind for long-term, it's not going to be an issue. I've been playing with a few ideas and having driven an unmodified and completely stock 05 car I'm quite seriously torn between picking up a low miles car and just buying it, driving it and living it with it in mostly stock trim (for which Seamybaby's would be perfect and is priced well). If I wasn't considering modifying the car and just living with it then I would automatically go for an 06 and newer anyway and as I already eluded to, the budget is flexible. I'm not looking to pull anyones pants down on their pride and joy. One of the options I've got is the availability of a donor engine (not from a 350Z and details of which I'm not going to divulge at this stage) in which case the mileage is almost a moot point and my figures for a 53 plate car with avg miles stand. Or of course, there is the middle ground - find something a bit newer and tidier than a 53 and just work with the stock engine and go the forced-induction route, in which case I'd want something with mileage on the lower side, and of course I'd expect to spend the appropriate money. My point is I'm flexible. At this stage I'm focussed on following the donor engined route as I have the option on an appropriate unit and have the resources of time, money and access to expertise to see it through. So this is why I'm evaluating 53-05 cars at this stage. If it seems I can't find an appropriate example where someone hasn't already invested themselves in the car (and developed an attachment which means their own appraisal of the vehicle is out of kilter with it's real value) then I'll have to look for newer cars and spend my money on running something newer in mostly stock trim - which I'm quite happy to do. I want to bottom out the modified option first as I plan to buy the car now and have it at least 2/3 complete before easter and various meets at 'The Pod' and down the southwest. So if I don't find something before the end of the month then I'm gonna be pushed to meet my own deadline so I can have fun in it this year rather than next year. In which case I'll start looking for a newer 350Z as a day-to-day drive and think about a different project altogether for next year. Not wanting to stray off-topic too much but there is another thing to note, and folks here should consider this when selling their higher valued pride and joys. If someone is looking to spend the thick end of £10K or more then part-ex will start to become a factor, particularly for me as I won't then keep my Cupra. If thats the case then I'll be looking at buying from the trade so I can get a warranty, etc. This is one of the main reasons people see cars prices plumet when selling cars in that price bracket. I had this issue myself a few years back when one of my family fleet was a BMW Mini Cooper S which had a book price of £12K in a private sale at the time. I had it up for £11K for months and no takers, all the time with prices dropping further, and I was forced to take £10K for it by just selling it direct to a BMW dealer. The next day they had the car up for sale for £13.5K and it didn't sit on their forecourt for more than a week before they had sold it. Thats how it works I'm afraid. I sat their choked at the prospect of loosing £2K where they made a tidy £3.5K for what seemed very little effort - 33% markup is a healthy profit in this day and age. Phil

I never said you did. It was your hijacking of my post which I took exception to, and the fact that you started bickering with someone else about the completely unrelated and irrelevant matter of who's car is fastest - it had nothing to do with anything. I'm modifying a car so all bets are off when it comes to comparing stock cars. Erm no. You merely told me I'd be disappointed in a 350Z after my Noble, even though I stated from the get go that I will be modifying this car - I really could not have made it any clearer right there in the first post. So why on earth you needed to start with the whole "Are you saying your car is faster than a boxster S or m3?" to someone else and then derail the thread is only because you had nothing better to do than troll. Your advise simply wasn't valid and you all but ignored the question possibly because you just assumed I'm another "I'm thinking about a 350Z newb" and frankly I do find that a tad rude, so maybe go back and read the very first post again? You didn't answer the question I asked, which was ONLY around whether my expectation of price was realistic, and I only asked that because I've seen so much overpriced crap out there and was wanting to find out if this was the norm, or to maybe find a quality car. The details of this site came to me via a friend that works in motorsport and suggested coming here to try and source a car and the perhaps share the project via these forums as I went.

You're assuming that my motorsport contacts didn't already direct me to these forums in my hunt for a car. You know what they say about that word 'assume' ? It makes an ASS out of U and ME. The suggestion that I can't do anything or know anything is hilarious. You know nothing about me and the fact that I turn dead dinosaurs into smoke and noise in ways you could scarcely comprehend. Phil

Hi Guys, I've had 'sign off' from 'she who must be obeyed' and I have cash waiting for the right car and I'm prepared to travel a long way to collect and drive away if there is a genuine bargain out there. I'm looking for low to avg miles with FSH, genuine UK GT spec car with leather and pref Sat Nav but it's not a deal breaker. Something between 53 and 05 reg, the budget is quite flexible and I haven't really set an upper limit. I'm looking for value for money rather than just the cheapest car out there. I've already walked away from around 6 cars I've seen advertised elsewhere as they were either cat C or D and the advertiser had tried to hide it, or the car had turned out to be an import. I've seen a lot of over-valued cars so far, although to be fair I've seen one or two very reasonable cars here on the forums and I've already contacted the owners so we'll see what that brings. I'm going by the Parker's guide 'Private Good' pricing for the right vehicle. If you've modified the engine extensively then I'm not likely to be interested as the car is for my own project and I don't want someone elses work - no disrespect. Thats said, if you've modified the suspension or some other aspect to improve handling then I would take it into consideration. Light cosmetic enhancements are ok, but I'll draw the line at a modest rear spoiler and nothing more extravagent than that please. Big engine mods are a definate no no I'm afraid - exhausts, decat, etc are fine though, so long as the OEM is included in the deal. To give you an idea of what I'm prepared to pay, my ideal is going to be a standard spec GT with leather 53 plate with avg miles - parkers is pricing around £5845 for a privately sold UK spec GT car and I can work upwards from there depending on year, miles and spec (The Glass trade-in price is £3000 to £4000 for the same car ... eek). So if you want you can check out their website and get a feel for what I'd be prepared to pay for a car between 53 and 05. I'm using Parkers as a guide deliberately, as it is broadly accepted that they are not hot on their updates atm unlike Glass's guide and so their prices are likely to be more favourable and possibly better reflect a well cared for car from an enthusiast on these forums. I'll consider any colour so long as it's not gold and I'd possibly pay a beer-token more for a blue one. Thanks for reading, but please no JDM cars or Cat C or D and if it looks like something out of The Fast And The Furious or a mad Tokyo Drift type movie then there won't be much point contacting me. Your 350Z really needs to be as standard as pos as I don't want to pay a premium for someone elses preference in terms of mods but I can also appreciate that this might be a big ask on these forums. PM me to discuss or exchange mobile numbers. Phil

Tobys, you have a PM.

Well I'm kinda sorry I posted really. I only wanted some buying advise and thought I'd introduce myself at the same time. Thanks for the info offered by Coldel, which confirms everything I had expected and means I'll stay on track and stick by my guns when it comes to looking for a genuine Z. To everyone else that hijacked my post and turned it into their own little p155ing contest ... Guys, seriously, if I had 50K to spend on a car do you really think I'd even be here asking for advise on a 350Z? The fact is that in this day and age I don't have that kinda dosh at my disposal any more. I'm not looking for a Noble killer and if I was then a 350Z would be the last thing on my list. Instead I'm trying to be realistic while looking for a rear wheel drive project car that I can drive every day and over a period of time start unlocking it's potential. My budget isn't unlimited, but it's pretty open-ended. I fully expect to spend the value of the car a couple times over during the space of a couple of years before I get it where I want it to be. To me that kind of expenditure is much easier to live with rather than blowing it all in one go on a car where it's market value will drop like a stone. If I wanted to start a war over which car is better I would have posted on Piston Heads instead. Some folks missed the point of my post entirely ... I didn't ask 'whats better?' I wanted to know if my expectation was misguided. If thats the kinda response I'm gonna get round here I might just keep my project to myself. Jeez. Oh and btw - some people need to learn how to 'quote' on forums properly so that your messages doesn't get lost in the noise of re-posted and regurgitated text. My first post and hijacked into the ground - thanks. Guess I'll see you around ... or maybe not ... who knows. Phil

My Cupra isn't an R and is completely and utterly stock. I bought it purely as a cheap runaround about 18 months ago and it's ticked that box as all I've had to spend money on is tyres, oil and filters. It's just turned 90k miles so it's on the low side for a 10 year old car and it's tidy, but the looks are pretty dull if I'm honest. Don't get me wrong, it's done me great and it's not dull to drive but I feel that as a front wheel drive s already near-ish the limit of it's potential. Don't forget - I've got no plans whatsoever to keep a 350Z in stock trim and I would really like a good project to get my teeth into. If I headed in the Boxster S direction I wouldn't consider tuning at all and I as far as the M3 is concerned I'd have to be spending a fair bit more on a similarly aged car. In the past I've also owned a couple of different Lotus Elise so I love RWD cars and the increased useable potential they can offer when you start dabbling Phil

Hey Guys, I think I'm in the market for a decent 2nd hand 350Z. Previously I've had a Noble M12 GTO3 which although was an awesome car it ended up being an utterly hellish experience when purchased as a brand new car - I won't bore you with the details but it got really messy and we ended up litigating. Suffice to say it's an experience which has dented my faith in the new car experience and since I'm actually a biker first and foremost I'm going to stick with investing the bulk of my income in my 180mph+ 0-60 in sub 3 seconds bikes. Currently I'm driving an '02 Seat Leon Cupra which, whilst it has been a cheap and reliable car, it's really not as quick as I'd like. So, my rationale was this ... look for a tidy and early 350Z and spend some cash on getting somewhere near the 360 bhp I was enjoying from the Noble. I'm not expecting it to handle quite like the Noble but I figured I should be able to enjoy a reliable 2nd hand jap car with a huge upgrade potential in terms of both power, handling and looks. I'd also been looking at spending a little more money and maybe looking at a Boxster S, an M3 or even an S2000 as I've just bought a '07 Honda Civic 1.8 EX VTEC for the wife and my local Honda dealer has a nice one there atm. However, I keep finding myself looking at the 350Z and there is something about pure cubic capacity that just can't be replicated any other way. So, this is the direction I'm gonna follow. If I'm looking at a '53 plate there appears to be a shed load of them on Autotrader all for a fiver under 6 grand, but just about everyone I've rang they all appear to be imports where the person selling it has omitted it from the advert and probably wouldn't have said anything until I asked them straight. Parkers guide seems to be telling me I should be paying around this for a legit UK 350Z GT model but it seems there are a lot of dishonest f$%£ers out there peddling JDM stuff. Is Parkers right? Or am I expecting too much? I was thinking of dabbling with an older/cheaper car first perhaps before changing it later in the year for an '06 or later plate - so hopefully won't loose much in 6 to 8 months but also I'll be certain that it's the right car for me. What do you guys think ? Phil