coldel

Yeah that helps a bit, but not great for being able to just see roads as its somewhat cluttered for city centres. I am astonished really that Google thought this was an improvement...its bonkers.

Anyway, back on track, deal agreed in principle - although more 'stuff kicked into the long grass' which has been the bane of the process so far. Even fishing isn't sovereign with rights for access to be agreed it seems based on leaked details.

I guess throwing questions back, if we all looked after our own, if Russia invaded Britain and took the country, its ok for everyone else to shrug their shoulders and just say 'we are looking after our own' - is that acceptable? And yes we have indirectly and directly had many wars with both Russia and China over the years, Crimea was a war of UK/US backed soldiers vs Chinese and Russian ones, thats in living memory too. As for the WW2 question, it is far too simplistic a question to give a simple answer to. The day Hitler ordered his troops over the border UK diplomats were in Germany discussing the proposition of safe haven for UK lands safe haven if we turned a blind eye to invasions of Poland surrounding countries. The fragmented nature of Europe at that time made it susceptible to military occupation, and so we saw that play out. It wasn't a case of them and us. I am not sure what you are actually afraid of? Is it that you think Germany are going to become Nazis and marching an EU army into the UK, is that really your concern? Is the distrust with particular countries? Or the concept?

Has anyone got a work around for being able to see roads properly on google maps yet? They apparently deliberately changed the look so points of interest are more visible but now its almost impossible to see the actual roads. I used to be able to flick the terrain option on to help but that seems to have stopped working now. Looking at the map to eyeball a decent route to Farringdon station from the office and I get this... Sat with my eyes level with the top of the monitor in the office as advised I find myself crouching down to try and get any sort of sense of roads on the map. Why in gods name do Google think this is a good idea!

If it was an EU army run by UK generals would the opinion be different, I imagine it would. The EU army debate is no different to the freedom of movement one, to the single market rules one etc. Because we aren't running the show its deemed unsuitable. No comments about Russian threats etc. will change that view.

Yes suds mean nothing, all it does do is give you some sort of visual indication of what you have laid down on the car, but if you are doing it properly you should be able to do that anyway. I just don't get the point in the whole package broken thing, just a stupid thing to decide a winner on. If he cannot pick a winner based on performance he shouldn't bother doing the test. I have had the same product before and the cap erm wasn't broken, which one should I go for then? He has to man up and pick a winner and stop including issues that aren't actually issues

Never realised the price of the 135i had dropped so much, its crazy. Starting prices on AT are around the 7k mark which is great value.

It can be done if you select your sources correctly with an open mind - as Ekona hinted to in another post around selecting information to make informed decisions. For instance the ONS reports actual figures, the press however will report opinion pieces, its not fact, its opinion. Its important to note the difference if you want to come to some sort of objective conclusion yourself on issues. Stuff like the radio guy ranting is not a reliable source of factual information, its an opinion piece. You cannot decide if an issue is right or wrong from that piece, you can only use it to reinforce a pre-disposition to your own view on it.

One for shampoo, one for mitt rinse, one for him to dip his dainty little hands into so they don't get too soapy for too long

So May is over in Brussels today, rumours are that the DUP forced her into changes to the declaration overnight...

From memory the US and Russia build the most and export the most. Countries like Saudi Arabia and India are biggest importers. Airbus as I understand it are based in four countries, do we make the wings? I think? I imagine companies like Lockheed, Boeing and various other American aerospace businesses have the lions share of trade, we are currently importing F-35s at huge cost for instance. Not sure the army is about preventing the UK being invaded, that's very unlikely to happen, what is happening is as above, the subversive nature of Russia spreading across eastern Europe, we shouldnt stick our heads in the sand and think it wont in any way affect us.

In answer to your question Doc, I suspect it goes along the lines of 'why should our soldiers go out and die because Russia annexes a bunch of people living 5000 miles away' - that would be a typical answer from a fervent anti-EU supporter. That's not to say there is no merit in it, its a fair question to ask. But on the other hand as you allude to Russia are looking to take back and create the USSR again, stand alone it cannot out do the US so needs extra economical capabilities as well as political influence in Europe, we should be very concerned, most in the UK admit they despise Putin and his iron foot, but seem happy to sit back and allow him to influence the political landscape of Europe. We cannot rely on the US currently, that might change in future, but Trump coming in has shown that overnight our special relationship means nothing and we are overly reliant on a partner that cannot be relied upon. Stu, I looked at the first 4-5 mins of that Guy video and am equally confused, clearly some of it contains disinformation such as 'juncker not democratically put in place' even though the UK vote in MEPs who then vote in the leader. I get we do not vote directly for the leader, but the democratic process i.e we vote in MEPs who vote on our behalf is clearly there. To call it undemocratic is incorrect, but suspect its because it drives the rhetoric required. Just seems like a rant to me rather than constructive evidence based debate. I could be wrong I didnt watch it all. Its a shame that us Brits are so emotive around the issue of Europe but are one of the least engaged countries when it comes to European elections.

Skipped to a few bits, just a ridiculous video. 15 mins in he says something along the lines 'the winner is valet+ because its cheap per litre' - is that it then, the winner is because its cheap?! Then at the end he is citing reasons to reject Gyeon Essence and he says the cap is broken?! What is this clown going on about!

I don't know enough about the EU army but from my basic reading the idea is that Europe can act as one against common threats (yes what if its a war we don't want to get involved in, but conversely what if its a war we are involved in but then Europe would back, us cite Argentina where lets not kid ourselves we very nearly got drawn into a long conflict we could have lost). I haven't read anywhere about the EU saying to defend against the US, all I have read is Trump vitriol because he had pressured countries into paying more into NATO but that spend would be in the form of US arms purchased from the US. The EU army would in effect reduce down the number of arms suppliers, generate better purchasing power, synchronise technology, build better defences, most likely utilise European weapons suppliers and not the US. Its all hypothetical anyway, we aren't in it. The world wont end because of an EU army. Just like our economy wont end because of Brexit.

I agree the comparison to Trump is not a good one (sorry Bri!) - he has been a car crash and the fall out will unveil itself over the next few years for others to recover the country from. Yes he delivered tax cuts as promised (which benefit business and the wealthy and not seen the increase in business to cover the loss revenue), dropped out the climate change agreement, pushed back on 'obamacare' and started annulling trade deals. The big problem is that he hasn't replaced the health care insurance as promised, he is encouraging anti-planet activities within his country which longer term are going to completely screw the economy, whilst the rest of the world works through the intricacies of utilising renewable energy he pumps money into pits and mines which have limited shelf life as well as ever increasing cost to produce vs the falling cost of renewables. Said he would pull out of NATO and bottled it. Of course the signature campaign effort around a Mexican wall was nothing more than a joke that got out of hand, did anyone tell him that 80% of all illegal immigrants fly in to the country? And of course he promised to bring back waterboarding for terrorist detainees, any surprise that didn't make it through the courts?!

Maggz, I get you are debating a point about if a referendum was seen to be unfairly contested, the result shouldn't stand, in principle that is correct. The reality of it is that the overspends, illegal funding etc. has only just come to light - what would you suggest we do? Given that we are on the verge of signing out of Europe? If we just say re run it then we exit next year with no deal doing substantial economic damage. Would the EU let us back in? Probably, but under the same terms as before, I would think unlikely. Would the population stand for the result suddenly being made null and void and changing the decision? Absolutely not, you are looking at very likely country wide civil unrest. It is an interesting hypothetical debate, but I cannot see anything being done about it in reality. I think we have to accept the vote was to some degree rigged, it was influenced by outside parties looking to subvert democracy realising that the vote was so close that subversive actions could swing it. It happened, it wont be the last time either, but we need to accept we live in an imperfect world. The energies need to be focused on sorting all this mess out, the general election last year was an utter disaster and has resulted in the split government, inter party rowing, we are too busy arguing a toss about anything and everything whilst an army of experienced EU negotiators pick apart weak links like David Davies - its sad we have a bunch people too busy arguing amongst themselves than actually trying to sort this all out, as much as we laugh at Trump I am sure there are many people outside the UK laughing at our leadership.

There is certainly a debate to be had about the legitimacy of voting. Both the referendum and the US elections faced unprecedented interference not before seen from subversive 3rd parties. It's no longer safe to assume the vote isn't tampered with by simply putting tamper proof tape on boxes. As we saw it only takes a couple of percent swing to change a major decision...the democratic voting system is not able in the modern age to deal with the flow of misinformation from placed social media accounts for instance. All that said...the results from the last referendum have to stand.

..and I am the only one that finds the whole situation ironic - in that we called it Brexit, as in Britain, exiting, but actually NI is part of the United Kingdom, not Great Britain. Were we not representing it incorrectly all along and here we are with NI the pivot of all the discussion

There is so much at stake here I also think we are missing the point on this withdrawal in that its not all in our hands also - we could see member states push back on it as well.

Its a shame people didn't vote because they didn't know what to believe, ultimately you will never have the full facts about anything be it a referendum, GE or local elections (all sides claim perfection under their regime right). That nearly a third of the country didn't put their vote to this but I have yet to meet a single person who doesn't have an impassioned view on staying or leaving. That aside, we have activated article 50, we have voted to leave, thats in the past and probably best left there. Lets be honest, the majority of people saw the situation where we are now coming except the most idealistic people like JRM who are just career climbers and using this as their vehicle. We are negotiating a withdrawal from one of the most powerful economic trading blocs on the planet, they have all the leverage in that half our trade is with the EU, around 5-10% of the EU is with us, its basic business and no surprise we have been pushed to the position we are today. Whats also interesting is that clearly we have had to spend a lot of time negotiating emotive industries like fishing etc. despite it being such a tiny part of our countries welfare - clearly to try and keep the population happy around the idea of sovereignty rather than any sort of economic benefit. The fact that the CBI have generally agreed on the exit deal shows that economically it could be viable and probably wasn't the worst case scenario but one that is acceptable given the situation we are in. The issue is a political one for me, do we allow the EU power of veto on the indefinite backstop, its a huge point as effectively it gives the EU power over the trading arrangements.

In response to the OP I would probably say without going into much depth Could or should TM (or any other politician) have got a better deal - depends on who you ask, for some industries the deal is a good one. The main contentious issue for me is the backstop which requires EU sign off, effectively a new article 50. Should we have another referendum - people demanded a vote on leaving the EU, leave won, leave voters pushed any argument against the process back saying the people had voted, then give people the vote now we know what the withdrawal looks like. Comments from Boris like 'they can go whistle' etc. about paying money clearly were not representative of the final outcome, now we know, lets vote - the question is, what is the actual question! Should parliament back her - politics is politics, many politicians will not be taking actions in the interests of the country. Economically no deal is worse than the deal, it really depends on if politics plays a bigger role than economic security Should she resign - not really, nothing more can be done by anyone else given the EU have said the deal is the deal. If she goes who goes in? A JRM candidate who would push us straight to a no deal anyway and be an immediate barrier to any future discussions with the EU, or a TM fan who just continues as is and nothing changes except a load of disruption? She is though unelectable I think so maybe post next year she is moved on and damage limitation in place for the next GE Should we have another election - we will, in 2022

...I have resisted for so long to start up this thread

I think its quite smart. Not in that its particularly pretty but smart in that you can in effect build wheels of much more intricate design than before. Be interesting to see them tested but if they are literally pieces of titanium bolted together it should retain its integrity - i mean if no one said your wheels were 3d printed and said here are some titanium wheels we would assume they would be ok.

Yeah it is overpriced. I got 26 early bird entry but then it's 12 quid parking and 40 quid on petrol...all adds up

A few more